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View Poll Results: Do you think passing this legislation will truly help?

Voters
27. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, I think it's a step in the right direction.

    14 51.85%
  • Yes, but it's only the tip of what really needs to be done.

    10 37.04%
  • No, this this repeal is gilded.

    0 0%
  • I don't care either way if it's repealed or not.

    3 11.11%
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Results 1 to 10 of 54

  1. #1
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Default Dont Ask Don't Tell--Homophobia or Sexual Repression?

    I did a search for gay and military and my blog was the third result. So hopefully this wasn't posted yet!

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101218/...ys_in_military

    ^ The source, the ever-so-reliable front page yahoo news.

    The vote was pretty close, but I hope the mock vote reflects the real one. It's been too long.

    Anyways.. My question is. Does anyone know the real source of the policy? Is it one, or both??
    In my eyes:

    If it's out of homophobia or general dislike or discomfort with homosexuals -- this shit needs to be ended in our government entirely before we can expect the public to follow suit. It makes little sense to expect the public to not be so hateful when the government is fine with policies like this.. Saying you support the troops but hate gays is crazy to me.. there are gays serving. That's the end result.

    And/Or..

    If it's sexual repression. What I mean by that is.. the fact that there are more people around with more opportunities to indulge into sexual behavior(something generally frowned upon) -- I think the army needs a better policy. Even though women are welcomed into the military, it isn't with open arms. One arm is behind the back, and crossed. I could go on and on all day about how the military tries to take out the feminine personalities of its soldiers.. For some reason, no one believes a woman, acting as a woman, could also indulge in fighting for their country and doing their duties. Last time I checked, personality and gender and little to do with the core values. The army starts more drama than it ever needs to by trying to avoid potential drama. Either the members of our service are adults, or they are not. This idea of perception is going to get WAY worse, paperwork is going to get more numerous, and these current way-too-strict policies will have even more opportunities for corruption and mayhem.

    If you're a woman.. you WILL be sexually harrassed in the workplace in the military. There are no if's, and's, or but's about that. How you handle it is different with everyone.. but it will be there. There are no percentages, or maybes.. you Will.

    I can only imagine harrassment increasing with the release of this information. I think it needs to be done.. but I think they're doing things the way they did in the civil war -- Let everyone go free and talk free.. and yet, change none of the barriers that kept them sheltered in the first place.. guaranteeing that this 'landmark legislation' will fail, but look really fancy and pretty on paper.

    Any thoughts? Am I totally off?
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
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  2. #2
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
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    Default

    I can't claim to know much about the military, but it seems to me that both factors are likely to be contributing to the overall result.

    It's nice to see someone in the military who doesn't (completely) agree with it, though, since its supporters tend to be more vocal if not more numerous. I'm glad to see it overturned, though I'm sure certain people will be very unhappy (which makes me happier)
    -end of thread-

  3. #3
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Ya know. I know it's suppose to be childish to rub it in and all. but. It does satisfy me a bit when cool things like this are passed, if for nothing else that it enrages the very people that are against it. >.> I dont' feel bad because I am sure they feel the same way..
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
    Halla74: Think your way through the world. Feel your way through life.

    Cimarron: maybe Prpl will be your girl-bud
    prplchknz: i don't like it

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  4. #4
    Senior Member swordpath's Avatar
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    Default

    Homophobia repression

  5. #5
    Per Ardua Metamorphosis's Avatar
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    I'll be interested to see how things change if it passes. For instance, if men and women have separate showers/bays/etc. wouldn't the straight and gay soldiers need separate ones for the same reasons?

    There's a guy in my platoon that is obviously gay (if I'm wrong I'll be really surprised). No one talks about it and no one really cares because the important thing is pulling your weight, and he does. I can't say that it wouldn't be considerably more awkward and difficult if it was open, but at the same time, I don't think anyone should be forced to hide it either.
    "You will always be fond of me. I represent to you all the sins you never had the courage to commit."

    Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions, and can never pretend to any other office
    than to serve and obey them. - David Hume

  6. #6
    Senior Member Fan.of.Devin's Avatar
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    It's quite clearly homophobia, but honestly, I don't think it is at all an honest or accurate representation of how the vast majority of the military feels.
    Ask just about anyone you meet who's in the military, private to officer; most of them will probably tell you they just plain don't give a shit about the possibility of their peers, superiors, or subordinates being gay.

    I think it's just leftover media figurehead BS, at this point.
    A veritable handful of self-important idiot congressmen and officers.
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  7. #7

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    I dont think there should be legislation about sexuality at all, all the gay advocacy in politics is at best an attempt to engage in faux crusading for liberation/equality/freedom, all the buzz words of the right on voters and its only result is to further profile a minority, often an minority's minority because not all homosexuals are either what could be described as "scene" or that political either.

    At worst its something altogether misguided, blundering and displeasing to everyone, it'll not be enough for the militant constituency its aimed at placating/satisfying, it'll be too much for the people opposed to it and could provoke opposition from people who never cared either way before.

    Just my two cents on this topic, same as the same sex "marriages" or "two kings" or "this penguin has two dads" and other gay schooling ideas, its all very "right on" for the true believers who're ready to get behind it but its aiming at a radical change in norms unreflective of the majority or history which would have really unintentional and catastropic consequences for society at large.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Fan.of.Devin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    ...a radical change in norms unreflective of the majority or history which would have really unintentional and catastropic consequences for society at large.
    Such as?
    Planes are going to fall out of the sky 'n shit because gay military members will be able to admit that they're gay whilst serving?
    You live in an interesting world.

    Also, not understanding how this qualifies as "gay advocacy"; it is the removal of an imbalance in personal liberty, not some sort of affirmative action.
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  9. #9
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I dont think there should be legislation about sexuality at all, all the gay advocacy in politics is at best an attempt to engage in faux crusading for liberation/equality/freedom, all the buzz words of the right on voters and its only result is to further profile a minority, often an minority's minority because not all homosexuals are either what could be described as "scene" or that political either.

    At worst its something altogether misguided, blundering and displeasing to everyone, it'll not be enough for the militant constituency its aimed at placating/satisfying, it'll be too much for the people opposed to it and could provoke opposition from people who never cared either way before.

    Just my two cents on this topic, same as the same sex "marriages" or "two kings" or "this penguin has two dads" and other gay schooling ideas, its all very "right on" for the true believers who're ready to get behind it but its aiming at a radical change in norms unreflective of the majority or history which would have really unintentional and catastropic consequences for society at large.
    So you're in favour of the legislation about sexuality being struck down, then. Right on.
    -end of thread-

  10. #10
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Its both; I vaguely remember polls (which means I can't actually support this contention right now) that military personel are more disapproving of homosexuality than others in their age brackets, but there are some legitimate army effectiveness issues regarding fraternization within the ranks, as well (though interestingly, some ancient armies used to promote situational homesexuality to encourage unit cohesion). I would also like to note that I'm willing to cut soilders more slack on this issue than would otherwise be the case; I hope this thread does not devolve into a bunch of people taking this as an opportunity to badmouth people in the military (unless commentators serve or have served in the past, in which case they've earned the privilage).

    This legislation is a good thing; ordinarily I would wait unitil peace time to support this (it will probably have some temporarily negative effects on cohesion and recruitment), but with the war going the way it is....also, there are currently a glut of recruits (I've heard the military is actually trying to slow down recruitment, which would explain the treatment of an honorary nephew of mine), so now is probably as good a time as any.

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