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    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Default Gallup research polls reveal high Muslim support for US, Obama, and moderate Islam


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    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    These specific surveys seem completely irrelevent to the thread which this is a rebuttal to.

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    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    These specific surveys seem completely irrelevent to the thread which this is a rebuttal to.
    The Obama stuff, less so. But Extreme Islam doesn't like Obama.

    Bottom line, the idea that Muslims hate America and are extreme is a brush stroke too broad, with studies and studies to back it up. They like us just fine, and non-combat Americans are much more likely to die from Latin Americans, who also like America generally.

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    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    Bottom line, the idea that Muslims hate America and are extreme is a brush stroke too broad, with studies and studies to back it up. They like us just fine, and non-combat Americans are much more likely to die from Latin Americans, who also like America generally.
    My thread was about support for the death penalty for apostates within Islam, not anti-Americanism or support for terrorism. Can you link to where any of these studies contradicts the Pew Research poll (which can hardly be accused of hyping the most unpleasant findings, they buried them in the middle of the article). To illustrate my point, I'll point out that segregationalists in the fifties would have voted overwhelming in support of democracy and (perhaps to a lesser extent) against extrajudicial lynchings-would you describe a segregationists with such nuanced beliefs 'moderate', or would you consider the very suggestion to be ludicrous?

    Put simply, you can't be moderate and support the execution of apostates at the same time; this does not mean that Muslims with extremist views support terrorism in pursuit of such goals, as I've pointed out myself in previous threads.

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    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    My thread was about support for the death penalty for apostates within Islam, not anti-Americanism or support for terrorism. Can you link to where any of these studies contradicts the Pew Research poll (which can hardly be accused of hyping the most unpleasant findings, they buried them in the middle of the article). To illustrate my point, I'll point out that segregationalists in the fifties would have voted overwhelming in support of democracy and (perhaps to a lesser extent) against extrajudicial lynchings-would you describe a segregationists with such nuanced beliefs 'moderate', or would you consider the very suggestion to be ludicrous?
    Seemed more like your original thread was about "a majority of Muslims in Nigeria are likewise bastards" and "worthless assholes", but, same message.

    I know it was about the death penalty, which goes hand-in-hand with Extremist Islam. The polls in Gallup don't suggest that their Muslim respondents in the US and the M.E. hold extremist views, like the death penalty for those leaving Islam. Quite the opposite.

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    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    And on Muslims and the death penalty specifically, they are becoming more in line with wussy Euro views on the matter, suggesting they liberalize when they immigrate:

    Common Ground for Europeans and Muslims Among Them
    Similar views on honor killings, crimes of passion, the death penalty

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    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    Seemed more like your original thread was about "a majority of Muslims in Nigeria are likewise bastards" and "worthless assholes", but, same message.

    I know it was about the death penalty, which goes hand-in-hand with Extremist Islam. The polls in Gallup don't suggest that their Muslim respondents in the US and the M.E. hold extremist views, like the death penalty for those leaving Islam. Quite the opposite.
    1.) The Muslims with those specific beliefs, yes. Do you object to my calling people with that specific belief bad names, or do you think the numbers are wrong so I'm unfairly labeling innocent people?

    2.) I would expect that Muslims in the United States would be unlikely to support it.

    As for the Middle East (which ranged from about 85% support in Jordan to about 5-6% support in Lebanon on the Pew poll), did the gallup pollsters ask the specific question, or are you extrapolating from their answers to
    different questions? I'm not just nit-picking here, this is an important distinction.

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    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    1.) The Muslims with those specific beliefs, yes. Do you object to my calling people with that specific belief bad names, or do you think the numbers are wrong so I'm unfairly labeling innocent people?

    2.) I would expect that Muslims in the United States would be unlikely to support it.

    As for the Middle East (which ranged from about 85% support in Jordan to about 5-6% support in Lebanon on the Pew poll), did the gallup pollsters ask the specific question, or are you extrapolating from their answers to
    different questions? I'm not just nit-picking here, this is an important distinction.
    I'd like a replication of a study suggesting death penalty for those leaving islam is a popular view in the M.E., that's a lot to ask.

    When they move to Europe, and of course America, support lessens. But the middle east itself, e.g. the youth-led Green Revolution movement in Iran, and most of these ME countries have large youth populations. They are liberalizing, even the conservatives there will go to Twitter to voice their outrage.

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    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    I'd like a replication of a study suggesting death penalty for those leaving islam is a popular view in the M.E., that's a lot to ask.

    When they move to Europe, and of course America, support lessens. But the middle east itself, e.g. the youth-led Green Revolution movement in Iran, and most of these ME countries have large youth populations. They are liberalizing, even the conservatives there will go to Twitter to voice their outrage.
    1.) Should I gather from that you object to my believing the Pew Research results, and not the fact that I think people who believe apostates should be executed are worthless assholes? And out of curiosity, would you object if I characterized the Westboro Baptist Church members the same way?

    2.) I hope you're right (the poll didn't cover children for obvious reasons), but current circumstances don't make me optimistic.

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    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    And out of curiosity, would you object if I characterized the Westboro Baptist Church members the same way?.
    The specific Westboro Church members, espeically Phelps... that's an individual. He is an asshole. What about the majority of the Baptist church, especially not in a joke? I think so.

    And "a majority of Muslims in Nigeria", now that you look back at it, you know wasn't cool.

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