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  1. #111
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    I am what I am.
    Just be happy you got Rubio elected, you got lucky.

  2. #112
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    Who says what rights we already have? Where did they come from, our creator, like the Constitution says?
    Our rights stem from our ongoing desire to hand our children a more civilized world than the one we were given. They come from the optimistic hope that mankind will be lead by the greater angels of its nature and not the lesser demons of its failings.

  3. #113
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    The government is there to protect the rights you already have, not to determine which rights you are lucky enough to enjoy.
    If God had given you property rights, then you would not need the government to enforce or even allow them -- they'd be self-enforcing. Property rights exist only to the extent that they are protected by force from those willing to violate them -- beyond that it's an empty concept.
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  4. #114
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    Our rights stem from our ongoing desire to hand our children a more civilized world than the one we were given. They come from the optimistic hope that mankind will be lead by the greater angels of its nature and not the lesser demons of its failings.
    Correct. They are a social construct. Thanks for confirming my point.
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  5. #115
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    Our rights stem from our ongoing desire to hand our children a more civilized world than the one we were given. They come from the optimistic hope that mankind will be lead be the greater angels of its nature and not the lesser demons of its failings.
    So they come from platitudes and cliches?

    The natural rights theorists in the room should read about the is-ought problem.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Is%E2%80%93ought_problem

  6. #116
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    Correct. They are a social construct. Thanks for confirming my point.
    You say this as if it negates their existence in the "real" world.

  7. #117
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    So they come from platitudes and cliches?

    The natural rights theorists in the room should read about the is-ought problem.
    I know where I stand on my beliefs pal.

    Don't you dare assume that I need to "read" otherwise.

  8. #118
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    Who says what rights we already have? Where did they come from, our creator, like the Constitution says?
    God, nature, the recognition of principle of self-government, whichever you like. Even if you don't like the natural rights reasoning, there is always the consequentialist argument.


    Or is it one of many concepts we simply created, that sound really nice.
    Sounds nice and is nice.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  9. #119
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksei View Post
    If God had given you property rights, then you would not need the government to enforce or even allow them -- they'd be self-enforcing. Property rights exist only to the extent that they are protected by force from those willing to violate them -- beyond that it's an empty concept.
    So might makes right?
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  10. #120
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Correct.
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