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  1. #1
    Oberon
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    Default Remember, Remember! Today's Date in History

    "Remember, remember
    The fifth of November
    The Gunpowder Treason and Plot;

    I know of no reason
    The Gunpowder Treason
    Should ever be forgot!"

    Happy Guy Fawkes Day, folks.

    -da mouse

  2. #2
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    The only man to ever enter Parliament with honest intentions. Too bad his methods of mass murder and dreams of theocratic revolution were destined to go unrealized.

  3. #3
    Ginkgo
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    Haven't progressed much, have we?

  4. #4
    Oberon
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    Yes indeed... he forgot a cardinal rule, namely that mass murder and theocracy are the province of governments, not individuals.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Yes indeed... he forgot a cardinal rule, namely that mass murder and theocracy are the province of governments, not individuals.
    One could argue that he made a sacrifice in order to demonstrate to the people that this is, in fact, well within the domain of the masters. I wonder, because my historical knowledge can be shoddy, what the frequency of rebellion was after the events unfolded.

  6. #6
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    One could argue that he made a sacrifice in order to demonstrate to the people that this is, in fact, well within the domain of the masters. I wonder, because my historical knowledge can be shoddy, what the frequency of rebellion was after the events unfolded.
    Difficult to say. Because, you know, a failed succession bid is a rebellion, whereas a successful succession bid is merely succession. At the risk of sounding like Victor... All rebellions are illegitimate unless they succeed.

    So deciding what's a rebellion and what isn't is pretty difficult, particularly among the old monarchies.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    One could identify common trends in both succession and rebellion. For example, one could say that successions with corresponding significant changes in mortality, arrests, legislation, or public morale in addition to critical analysis by observers not involved in the events would yield some information that would indicate that the change was not wholly within the status quo. Even indications that such changes would occur by way of threatening the balance of power with force would be easy enough to spot and label the event, quite accurately I believe, as rebellion.

  8. #8
    Listening Oaky's Avatar
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    Ah, wonderful fireworks being watched in the night. Beautiful.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    I remember the gunpowder treason but not because I think Guy Fawkes was doing wrong or serving a tyrant, he was a scape goat too and his actions where used to attack scots in england, the English did not like the scots perceived rise in status and fortunes from King James onwards, even though he was a protestant monarch and united the British Isles as a nominally protestant union, the seperate nationalities with seperate royal houses and different religious movements and schisms always where divided and sectarianism against the RCs only provided unity for a brief period historically speaking.

    That rhymn and the bonfire and burning the Guy traditions are about condemning treason, ironic considering what a lot of people since have believed.

    Its a little like the whole Che thing.

  10. #10
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    I keep hearing about Guy Fawkes day and I still don't get what it is. It's like it keeps getting explained to me and it never sticks. is it a good thing or a bad thing or...?
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

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