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  1. #11
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    They would try to stay in the business, possibly even getting more violent for a while, but legitimate corporations would eventually run them out of the business (they'd have no chance of competing against a company like Wal-Mart). Organized crime would see a drastic reduction in revenue.
    More than likely they (or at least some) would jump at the chance to go white collar and reap even larger, legitimate profits.

  2. #12
    Senior Member StrawMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    More than likely they (or at least some) would jump at the chance to go white collar and reap even larger, legitimate profits.
    How could you reap larger profits? There would be more supply, when for example pharmaceutical companies and their efficient supply chains would come into business to compete. Would there be any more demand? If you go by the portuguese example, no. So more supply and competition, same demand --> prices would go down.

    Edit: Come to think of it, there might be more people in the US than Portugal who might smoke pot every now and then, if there wouldn't be any legal problems. Just a hunch.

  3. #13
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    More than likely they (or at least some) would jump at the chance to go white collar and reap even larger, legitimate profits.
    There is no legal business with a profit margin like illegal drug dealing.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  4. #14
    DoubleplusUngoodNonperson
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    can we just admit that there exists no political capital inside the US with which a politician can affect change about this issue? please? it would help me greatly to think we aren't as economically stupid as this, i refuse to believe we are that dense about human incentives. i need to find a rational reason for it, and its just that = a politician really wanting to decriminalize won't have a face to save after ideologies in the political arena get through with it. just think about ALL the interests based upon temperaments there are.... all the SJs "dead set" against drugs no matter what, just on principles and what not, all the churches dead set against it... the mothers of dead drug addicts coming up to you and other politicians going "why is my son/daughter dead?". its not about reason, its about who is actually going to MAKE that choice? As far as i can see, no one in either party is going to touch it. look at all the pressures against vs for it and tell me im wrong there?

    This whole issue demonstrates to me that reason itself is never enough, not even close. as a student of philosophy it pains me to say that politics seems more powerful than human reason.

    so depressing .... to once again know, the fucking Greeks were right all along. I almost resent them at times!

  5. #15
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nozflubber View Post
    can we just admit that there exists no political capital inside the US with which a politician can affect change about this issue? please? it would help me greatly to think we aren't as economically stupid as this, i refuse to believe we are that dense about human incentives. i need to find a rational reason for it, and its just that = a politician really wanting to decriminalize won't have a face to save after ideologies in the political arena get through with it. just think about ALL the interests based upon temperaments there are.... all the SJs "dead set" against drugs no matter what, just on principles and what not, all the churches dead set against it... the mothers of dead drug addicts coming up to you and other politicians going "why is my son/daughter dead?". its not about reason, its about who is actually going to MAKE that choice? As far as i can see, no one in either party is going to touch it. look at all the pressures against vs for it and tell me im wrong there?

    This whole issue demonstrates to me that reason itself is never enough, not even close. as a student of philosophy it pains me to say that politics seems more powerful than human reason.

    so depressing .... to once again know, the fucking Greeks were right all along. I almost resent them at times!


    One of the prospective Republican candidates for president in 2012 is pro-decriminalization.

    Gary Johnson: Legalize Marijuana to Stop the Drug Cartels
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  6. #16
    DoubleplusUngoodNonperson
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    interesting.... but will he have support? that's what i meant whereby making reference to political capital. there's seemingly no momentum for it.

    EDIT: in fact, the biggest proponent of it in recent past has really only been Nader, and he was independent. are you telling me the republicans are gonna support decriminalization, in this day and era? its like .... unfathomable. America has become more xenophobic and stern, not more liberal minded and softer.

  7. #17
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    The Cato paper reports that between 2001 and 2006 in Portugal, rates of lifetime use of any illegal drug among seventh through ninth graders fell from 14.1% to 10.6%; drug use in older teens also declined. Lifetime heroin use among 16-to-18-year-olds fell from 2.5% to 1.8% (although there was a slight increase in marijuana use in that age group). New HIV infections in drug users fell by 17% between 1999 and 2003, and deaths related to heroin and similar drugs were cut by more than half. In addition, the number of people on methadone and buprenorphine treatment for drug addiction rose to 14,877 from 6,040, after decriminalization, and money saved on enforcement allowed for increased funding of drug-free treatment as well.
    Cato is good for one thing, and that's drug policy.

  8. #18
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    More than likely they (or at least some) would jump at the chance to go white collar and reap even larger, legitimate profits.
    First, I don't think many, if any, would succeed at such a jump. Second, if they are really obeying the law, who cares? Third, even if they did succeed making the jump, their profit margin would drop due to competition (high profit margins would attract legitimate investors from around the world) and the fact that they can't just murder their competition anymore.

    I think some would try to go legit, but they would all fail. They'd be forced to fall back to their other, less lucrative, rackets.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  9. #19
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
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    There is a reason why cops like the criminalization of drugs or prohibition in general.

    1. Easy and relatively safe busywork: Fighting real crimes like murder/robbery/burglary is difficult and dangerous. Fighting drugs is relatively easy (i.e. someone who is caught and searched incident to arrest or warrant and found with a small amount of dope to pressure them to name the names of their connections, shaking down junkies/probationers/parolees). Also the power aspect as it is easy to plant drugs on the innocent.

    2. Run across money stashes/bribes that supplement their income.

    3. Never a shortage of work. War on drugs and the prison system (with its access to drugs) turns criminals into junkies and those caught with drugs into criminals (i.e. prison like a college on how to be a criminal/gangster).
    I redact everything I have written or will write on this forum prior to, subsequent with and or after the fact of its writing. For entertainment purposes only and not to be taken seriously nor literally.

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    Spamtar - a strange combination of boorish drunkeness and erudite discussions, or what I call "an Irish academic"

  10. #20
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nozflubber View Post
    EDIT: in fact, the biggest proponent of it in recent past has really only been Nader, and he was independent. are you telling me the republicans are gonna support decriminalization, in this day and era? its like .... unfathomable.
    An old warrior like William Buckley became pro-legalization...it could happen. I admit it would be a steep uphill climb, though. The best way is to get Republican support through the back door, by emphasizing state sovereignty and limited federal power, which would allow individual States to legalize at their own pace (and show how such policies would work in an American context).

    I'm still uncomfortable with decriminalization as opposed to legalization, though...if something's still illegal (even if it shouldn't be), then violaters should at least get a slap on the wrist, such as community service and/or a fine in addition to an option for addiction treatment.

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