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Thread: Consideration

  1. #31
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Unfortunately those two go hand in hand, it's usually the radical minorities who are the most vocal. They're the ones who kick up a fuss and it just snowballs from there.
    That's not actually what I meant. I meant a small percentage of the people we're talking about not a minority as in Asians in East Anglia.

    I can see what you mean though. However I counterbalance that concept with the idea that cornered dogs bark louder.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Yeah, we're pretty much overshadowed by our neighbors to the south. Canada tho is essentially the worlds melting pot of cultures.
    Well they're louder, brasher and more important
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    On the topic of building places of worship etc mentioned in the OP. I'm mixed on the whole issue. On one hand I have no issue with them wanting a place to goto and practice their religions whatever it maybe. On the other I've been watching them come over and literally take over entire communities. Once they get a foot hold in one area they congregate and setup their own little communities eventually pushing out those whole were there before them. It's like watching a wildfire.

    From where I'm sitting at this very moment in my office there is basically 4 Mosques. 5yrs ago there was 1 a few blocks south of here, 3 years ago there was another built 1 block south of here, last year another was built 1 block north of here, and right now they're finishing the completion on the 4th two blocks north of here. I'm starting to feel like an outsider, and the reactions I get from the vast majority of the people who inhabit this area these days don't really do anything but make me feel like I don't belong in this area anymore.

    It's getting to the point where unfortunately whole cities/communities are starting to be referred to in derogatory terms by the populace at large based on the cultures that have settled there and taken over. Woodbridge is known as Wopbrdige, Agincourt is known as Asiancourt, Bramalea is known as Bramaledesh.. Hell the fact that its starting to show up in Wikipedia like in the Agincourt entry speaks volumes.

    In the end I'm torn on the whole issue. It's all just one big sad clusterfuck. :/
    Well that's a real crunch point isn't it. Let one family in.. sure no problem. They now would like some other people around them... that's reasonable. They want their friends... okay. Now the friends of the friends of the family want to join in. Where do you draw the line? Surely it would be draconian to say only one foreign lot per street but it's also foolish to just open the gates.

    Not being familiar with the whole size of these blocks you refer to I've no idea what kind of area you're on about but wasn't it ever asked "can you not go to the one down the road?" or would that be considered as being inhospitable?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Well you coulda have told me that sooner, instead of getting my hopes up
    It's not you it's me. I've changed. What ever happens we'll always have Montreal
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  2. #32
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    What makes it worse is when they play off the sympathies of the people by dragging up past issues. Where even tho it's not the case and hasn't been for a long time, trying to defend against that tactic is basically treated as you doing the same exact thing they're claiming in the first place. It's kinda like that judgment thread Toonia made..
    Yeah. Bloomin women. I've never oppressed them in my.... oh hang on.. you meant.. oops



    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    My ancestors, the Acadians, settled the area now known as Nova Scotia in 1604. They lived, farmed, fished, worked, worshiped and raised their families there for 150 years. The English warmongers burned the Acadians' houses and farms, took their land, gathered them onto boats, splitting up families and friends, and dispersed them at American ports along the Atlantic seacoast.

    I think I want my land back now, or else perhaps the Queen should just reimburse me and my family in cash, plus 250 years' worth of interest.
    3 shillings and six pence should cover it

    I think we should just point out to all you ex colonies that we're stressed because we now feel hemmed in and we shall be taking you all to court for undermining one's empire and making us stay in this little rainy isle.

    Oh and we want reimbursing for the tea :steam:

    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  3. #33
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
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    *INTJMom adds new word to profanity filter.*

  4. #34
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    ...
    3 shillings and six pence should cover it
    ha!

    I think we should just point out to all you ex colonies that we're stressed because we now feel hemmed in and we shall be taking you all to court for undermining one's empire and making us stay in this little rainy isle.

    Oh and we want reimbursing for the tea :steam:

    right.

  5. #35
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    *INTJMom adds new word to profanity filter.*
    I did wonder myself if it would cover derivations of swear words. Just goes to show that with a filter you pick up the new ones even faster
    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    ha!
    Wha? Hey this is good english stuff here.
    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    right.
    Just think of the benefits. No more Bush. No need to worry about who to lead. You have the Queen and that's it. Simple see. Less taxing for the fanatics
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  6. #36
    Large Member Ender's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    Do you have that problem in Canada?
    First Nation or somebody else?
    All of them actually. There's been a few recent flare ups with the First Nations.

    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    My ancestors, the Acadians, settled the area now known as Nova Scotia in 1604. They lived, farmed, fished, worked, worshiped and raised their families there for 150 years. The English warmongers burned the Acadians' houses and farms, took their land, gathered them onto boats, splitting up families and friends, and dispersed them at American ports along the Atlantic seacoast.
    I do understand that as well, however I'm not one of the ones who did it, I don't agree with what they did, and I can't help that fact. It's over, it's the past. By constantly using what others did in the past to judge my actions is only going to do one thing, and that is push me to the point where I break and retaliate. It's human nature when threatened to lash out.

    I pretty much take the same approach to relationships, I try my hardest to look past what others did to me in the past, only comparing the good aspects of one person to the good aspects of another, the only time i like to compare the bad aspects of the past is when the new ones are the opposite. I'm human tho, and in that sense I'm not infallible. There are times when I can't help but judge based on the past, it's a human self preservation instinct and it's something I fight with internally all the time.

    But thats a whole other topic altogether

    Oh and, I don't mean you literally INTJMom. I'm just speaking rhetorically.

    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    I think I want my land back now, or else perhaps the Queen should just reimburse me and my family in cash, plus 250 years' worth of interest.


    How about a nice shiny nickel?
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  7. #37
    Senior Member Sandy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    To be honest I hadn't thought of the whole border jumpers situation. I can't believe that the companies wouldn't be held responsible for hiring workers without proper papers anyway.

    I'm glad we have no borders, not that it seems to stop the problem entirely but such situations I'd imagine are quite rare over here. It'd cost them more to travel back to their home than they would earn!

    Still are you saying then that the Mexican are effectively suing those companies for now returning illegal workers back to their homes or am I not reading it straight?
    I'm sorry I didn't see your response earlier, Xander.

    Starting January 1st of this year, a new law goes into affect that prohibits companies in AZ using illegal immigrants, or they could lose their business license.
    My unpolitically correct response? It's about time! :steam:

    No, the Mexican officials (legislatures) of Sonora is pleading with AZ lawmakers to reverse this new law (because they can't afford their citizens coming back).

    Their request is amazingly bold, and my head feels like it's going to explode when I read these kinds of things.
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  8. #38
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandy View Post
    I'm sorry I didn't see your response earlier, Xander.

    Starting January 1st of this year, a new law goes into affect that prohibits companies in AZ using illegal immigrants, or they could lose their business license.
    My unpolitically correct response? It's about time! :steam:

    No, the Mexican officials (legislatures) of Sonora is pleading with AZ lawmakers to reverse this new law (because they can't afford their citizens coming back).

    Their request is amazingly bold, and my head feels like it's going to explode when I read these kinds of things.
    Looking ahead though I'm wondering if that'll mean that Mexico will then enter the long list of countries who require aid of one type or another. I agree that it's no good just letting the money bleed out of the state and country like that but I think that aid will do just the same. Well at least there will be a centralised control on it... well I say control....

    Oh and I don't think it's politically incorrect to say "about time too". Yes the people you are talking about are foreign but I think that's the problem with people and political correctness. It's gone too far.

    Similar to racism and all the other blue touch paper subjects people have become unnerved around them. If I refer to a person by their nationality it is not necessarily racist or jingoistic (not sure of the dividing line between those two terms) unless constructed or construed as such. If construed to be racist/ jingoistic when not meant in that manner then does it not say more about the accuser than the accused?

    Personally I think that a lot of the problems regarding integrating new cultures and dealing with sensitive issues like immigration levels and such could be directly attributed to those who "protest too much". Those people who run around looking for someone to possibly infer something derogatory so that they can level them with abuse more appropriately designed to address perhaps Neo Nazis or some such. Perhaps more effort should be made to address those people, on BOTH sides of the equation. To my mind half the problem that people face when a new culture moves in is the stress it bring with lots of people all to ready to tell you what you can and can't do now there are these new people around. Great that doesn't set them as separate and different. Perhaps if the PC police actually stood back and kept quiet they'd see that people aren't half as hostile if you don't tell them to change their lives to suit "the new guy" and just let them integrate people as and when they see fit.

    This leads me onto another problem possibly for another thread but I think that it's more the heart of what this is on about...discrimination when used as a tool to enforce "integration".

    Say you get a new manager at work... okay so the useless ones walk in with an arrogant air and just assume you'll bend over for them cause they're managers. The good ones will actually meet people and try to get to know everyone and will only pull rank if it's necessary and otherwise maintain this friendly air even after they've established themselves. The worst idea is to pick someone who has no obvious qualifications for the role and then set them as superior to most others. Is that not what we do with what some term as "positive discrimination"?

    I work in an engineering company. It's less than say 30 workers. We will NOT recruit someone who has to pray to Mecca three times a day. Why? Well why wouldn't everyone else take up the religion to get the extra breaks? Before you even start this one person would be set apart from the others and treated differently. Why? Is it a medical need? No. It was a choice they made for themselves. Ergo in my book it should be a case of it's optional whether or not companies allow these extra breaks. That way the guy who wishes to pray to Mecca has the choice, select a job that supports it or find another way to pray. Harsh? Perhaps but why should the choices of the few affect the many in a country which supports democracy? Sure you shouldn't ride rough shod where there is no call to but it seems to be going too far the other way. Now if we did have one applicant who I believe stated that they would prey but make the hours up. My gaffer decided not to hire them primarily because he didn't want someone taking extra breaks as it'd set a poor precedent to the other workers. Now the daughter of this man phoned up demanding to find out why his application had been rejected. It seems a little paranoid to me, or perhaps precalculated, that she'd be so "on the ball". Sure you could assume that all's well and she's just making sure it wasn't because he's asian but even then it's a little presumptuous to phone up a person and ask them if they would like to sign themselves up for litigation! I have to wonder how many places would turn round and go "no it's cause we don't want no darkies in here"... it's all slightly ridiculous. Anyhow the point being that the concerns that my gaffer had were valid and reasonable but he felt, and I would agree, that to mention them or to try and discuss it as civilised people would get no where. This is the problem as when I come to think of it I've only known one person who reacted to any of these things, it was an extremely insecure, ungainly large black gay lad who seemed to think that his skin colour would get him a free jail pass or something. Aside from that one case everyone I know who is religious will discuss it, all those I know who "ain't from round ere" are perfectly relaxed about it (including one guy from Bavaria who was witness to an outburst of "Nazi" [aimed at someone else] who then looked confused when everyone was suddenly meekly apologising to him ). So either where are these masses of offended people or why do three people within a minority feel the need to make so much damn noise and what on earth are those people who are in the majority but who feel the need to over support minorities thinking of? Well either that or is everyone I know an exceptional individual?
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  9. #39
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandy View Post
    I'm sorry I didn't see your response earlier, Xander.

    Starting January 1st of this year, a new law goes into affect that prohibits companies in AZ using illegal immigrants, or they could lose their business license.
    My unpolitically correct response? It's about time! :steam:

    No, the Mexican officials (legislatures) of Sonora is pleading with AZ lawmakers to reverse this new law (because they can't afford their citizens coming back).

    Their request is amazingly bold, and my head feels like it's going to explode when I read these kinds of things.
    I'm with you. It's about time.
    Tough luck to the Mexican government.
    America doesn't owe the world a living.

  10. #40
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    I'm with you. It's about time.
    Tough luck to the Mexican government.
    America doesn't owe the world a living.
    True enough though there is a large body of thought on the whole idea of responsibility to other countries. Could this be deemed as one of those responsibilities? I'm presuming that there is a time delay on the law so those who now rely on income as an illegal immigrant aren't left destitute whilst the money launderers sort things out.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

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