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  1. #61
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GemPOPGem View Post
    Or better still, bully the bullies' parents.

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  2. #62
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    I'd totally do something like that. I can be scary even if someone messses with my nephew.

    So if I ever decide to have a child, it should probably be with someone slightly more reasonable or sensible than me.

  3. #63
    Emerging Tallulah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    Did his actions really achieve the optimal consequences? Seems like we can't really know this. Maybe the bullies now say "haha your daddy had to come save you because you're so pathetic". Or maybe not. Maybe the other kids on the bus are having nightmares about an adult losing it. I just think we really can't know exactly what the consequences of his actions were.

    If you compare all the possible strategies he could have used, do you really think he picked the one with the highest EV? I don't think it's as easy to say as a lot of people here seem to think.

    I may have done the same thing. I'm not judging the dad -- I really have no idea what I would do if I had a disabled child being bullied (it would be fucking horrible, I'm sure). I just don't know if this is how we want people in our society to solve problems.

    It's at least up for question
    .
    That, in a nutshell, is how I feel about the whole thing, really. I don't think it's how we should handle things in our society on a regular basis--but I do think that it's probably a natural reaction to a situation where someone felt protective of a child and powerless to help them. I think it's a natural "dad" reaction, and I can understand it.

    The other side of the coin is, is the bullying behavior and the hands-off parenting that enables it, what we want in our society, and if it isn't, what is to stop it? The school officials' hands are bound for fear of lawsuits. It no longer takes a village to raise a child. Every family is an island, and if your family doesn't take an active role in your molding into a productive citizen, you're left to run wild. Who steps in in the gray areas, and what can we do to make situations like this unnecessary?
    Something Witty

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsWhatHeSaid View Post


    Bully's mom: I don't talk to him like that and I don't want anyone else to talk to him like that." FUCK THAT SHIT. THAT'S WHY HE'S A FUCKING SADISTIC BULLY.
    I completely agree. If you don't discipline your kids, and let them rule you, then they'll have a narcissistic sense of entitlement that they may unleash on other people. Duh.

    Behind every sociopath is an enabling mother.

  5. #65
    No moss growing on me Giggly's Avatar
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    Wow. Best Dad Ever.

  6. #66
    Senior Member Vamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    Being one that's worked in the American school systems, and having a father that drives a school bus, we're all limited to the point where we cannot stop, prevent, or control bullying. We. Can. Not. It costs us our jobs, every. single. time. It's why I stopped substituting, and why I cannot and never will be a teacher. I cannot control my morals when it comes to that. I cannot stand idle and watch something like that.

    The schools don't do shit about this, tie our hands behind our backs, and then wonder why parents try to take matters into their own hands.


    I've gotten onto a bus before to yell at children as well on behalf of my baby sister.. but I didn't threaten them. I asked for their names, and their parent's names and numbers, and I said that I was not leaving until I had those things because I was scared for my baby sister's life. The fiasco diffused when the bus driver allowed me to ride to the school and go with him to talk to the faculty, but nothing was ever really done about it.

    I don't blame him at all. I don't think his choice of words were inappropriate at all.

    If you fuck with someone's daughter, especially someone disabled, you're going to get your shit wrecked one way or another. My father never would have thought twice about going to jail to protect my ass... and I don't think twice about it either.
    This, especially the bold parts. I have a family full of teachers and even if I didn't I know that teachers and other authority figures on site are powerless.
    Ironically (in a way that explains a lot), the bully's parents are always the most vocal parents; if anything goes down, even if their snotty little rascal deserved it, expect them to be the first coming down to the school and raging infront of the kids.
    Bullied kids' parents are usually the last to get confrontational. This dude was probably all out of options and reached his breaking point. More control of words would have been nice.

    But,the bullies obviously needed someone to put their foot down. From what one of the bullies' mother said, it's clear that boundaries are not being instilled.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tallulah View Post
    I don't think that you can reason with bullies. Especially the type whose parents clearly aren't doling out any punishments at home. The only way to knock a bully down a few pegs is to give the same back to him. Not PC, but there you have it. The father shouldn't have used the language he did, but I certainly don't blame him for losing his cool on behalf of his disabled daughter. Clearly no one else was going to stop the bullying. Not the school, not the bus driver, and not the bullies' parents.
    Sadly, in my experience this has been true. Standing up and blowing them over is the only way to nip it because bullies tend to be big cowards. A good deal of bullied kids are incapable of defending themselves- either by temperament or disability.

    Quote Originally Posted by blankpages View Post
    This is so typical. It pisses me off. Schools are so quick to blame the victim. Well, he should fight back or something. Well, he should just try to keep out of their way. Well, she should just ignore them and walk away; by reacting she's just giving them what they want. Well, she should stand up for herself instead of just walking away; silently walking away demonstrates passivity. Well, victims should try harder to fit in. Well, they shouldn't try so hard to win others' approval; that shows they care what others think of them. Why is it always the victim's fault? Because that means they don't have to take any responsibility? :rolli:

    I had a junior high teacher who would stand there on playground supervision and watch others verbally degrade me, as if it were some fascinating TV show. He later said in class that only "weak people" get picked on, and named some kids who didn't get picked on because they were "strong".

    I don't know all the details of this situation. Yeah, he shouldn't have threatened the bus driver and all the kids on the bus. But if he'd tried to talk to the school before and got no results (which seems to be the norm), then I don't blame him at all for coming in and threatening the bullies.
    I got this kind of treatment from teachers and my parents. It's really head spinning "stand up to them!" "no, don't give them any attention" "quit being weird". Bah.
    I think the ineffectiveness of the school system causes this social decay and it will escalate. I agree with those who mentioned that it should be made harder to raise a bully by placing the inconvenience on bullies' parents.
    George Bernard Shaw in cartoon form.

  7. #67
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Dad did the right thing. I mean threatening killing anyone might be over the top but the general gist of the thing was absolutely correct. I'm a parent and people don't fuck with my children, period.

    There is no waiting to go through the proper channels because they simply don't exist in public schools. There is no area for teachers/principals/administrators to make common sense decisions because that's all been removed due to liability and policy. It comes down to this - that kid is a bully because his parents make him that way most likely. They are responsible. Just like the father of the bullied little girl is responsible for his child. That's just what he was doing.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  8. #68
    Ruler of the Stars Asterion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    You think using words they haven't heard is the reason screaming at 12 year olds isn't cool?
    We were yelled at by the principal all the time, sometimes it's necessary and it's going to happen later in life. But I guess you're right, I just don't think that's as big a deal as it was made out to be.

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    I think the point is that the girl hasnt done anything wrong, and yet it's the parents that are stuck with the extra duties while bullies go unaddressed. Taking her to school everyday won't stop the bullying in school itself either. The bus is just one piece. So what then? You'd take your kid out of school entirely??
    Depends on whether the bullies were in the same year level or not. There's a good chance that they were in a higher year level, so during school she'd almost never see them. Don't you think her dad would have gone to school and yelled at them in the classroom if that was the case??
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  9. #69

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    I definitely sympathize with the guy, but he also in effect punished and traumatized everyone on the school bus due to the actions of a few. If I rode that bus I wouldn't want to go near it the next day. Plus, the poor girl will probably turn from a bullied social outcast into a feared and mostly ignored social outcast. Maybe that's an improvement (???) but his shotgun approach likely won't help his daughter or him in the long run. The school can take different measures with him now that he's been arrested for disorderly conduct. Now there's a precedent for school officials to treat him differently and possibly bar him from school grounds in light of the threats he made to the guilty and the innocent. Though he likely feels better emotionally, he essentially screwed himself in the long run. Still, you have to feel for him. It only adds to the tragedy that his daughter has cerebral palsy. But making blanket threats in the manner that he did (caught clearly on videotape) is never excusable and should not be celebrated or condoned.
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  10. #70

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsWhatHeSaid View Post


    Bully's mom: I don't talk to him like that and I don't want anyone else to talk to him like that." FUCK THAT SHIT. THAT'S WHY HE'S A FUCKING SADISTIC BULLY.
    +1

    I can understand the authorities telling this guy that it wasnt the right tact to take, I can equally understand that he was behaving protectively and its one of the reasons why I dread having children because I would go to war on anyone threatening to make them miserable.

    I've gone out on a limb sometimes for the kids I work with. Who are from a population of individuals for the most part who could be considered to live with complex trauma, that's rejections and traumatic anxiety from such an early age that its effected the wiring of their brains. They are over represented in both the bullied and the bullying groups in school or the community, they generally have poor social skills and wont grow out of it. As I say I've gone out on a limb and anyone who tries to intimidate them I generally meet head on, unless the kid in question has done enough to put themselves beyond my caring about them (ie assault me, assault others, assault their peers and behave without pity or remorse). Although that falls far short of what I'd feel like doing for kith and kin.

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