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View Poll Results: Should sex offenders be treated humanely (in prison)?

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  • Yes.

    50 73.53%
  • No.

    13 19.12%
  • Unsure.

    5 7.35%
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  1. #81
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5231311252 View Post
    I thought about that as well, but then multiple other people (including a priest) stepped forward to attest his claim. Not only that, the prison itself has a shady history:
    Am I the only person who doesnt find it surprising that prison is not a place to go to have a good time.

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    Do you also condone the rape of thieves in prison? What about drug addicts? These people also commit their crimes knowing that they could get raped in prison.

    Sorry, I just don't buy this argument. People should not be getting raped in prison, period. We should never condone it. What we should do is properly punish people under the law. If you don't like the law, get it changed.
    I dont think anyone is condoning it, like I said in my first post, in fact I think its really stupid to conflate the natural and logical consequences of locking up a lot of sex offenders together and rape as a deliberate public policy.

    We're not talking about just desserts here and I dont think anyone could be suggested to be saying this, its a dumb circular and political debate game to do that the same as "You favour welfare cuts? Oh, well you obvious like to starve underprivilege babies, especially ethnic minoriites, you so racist!".

    Its not just desserts but it is a natural and logical consequence of warehousing a lot of these individuals together, they carry on like they always have, preying upon the weakest and most vulnerable, out in the world it was defenceless kiddies, in the big house it could just be the child rapist themselves that's at the lowest point in the "food chain".

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Am I the only person who doesnt find it surprising that prison is not a place to go to have a good time.
    No I said the same thing, but now I know you have me on ignore.

  4. #84
    lab rat extraordinaire CrystalViolet's Avatar
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    You know sex offenders almost invarible have a history of sexual abuse themselves (I mean the paedophiles etc).
    I believe there a fair amount of hysteria associated with paedophiles, but no-one ever seems to look at thier history etc. Some of them are no longer capable of healthy sexual relations. I do believe they are in need of compassion.
    That said, if any of the kiddy fiddlers went near any of my love ones, I would slit thier thoarts in the middle of the night while they were sleeping. No regrets, but endless torture...I could do it, but why?
    I remember reading an article about a convicted paedophile. He just couldn't help himself (I do believe he felt remorse and shame), in the end he took himself and his wife to a remote community where there were no children, in the middle of the NT in OZ. He tried to seek help...even submitted himself to various medical research trials and treatment. It was very hard to not to feel compassion for this man, perhaps because he was one of the few you hear about who actively sought to try and change. (he wasn't violent, I know it doesn't jusify it...)
    Truth is I believe they belong away from society, safe from themselves and safe for others.
    Currently submerged under an avalanche of books and paper work. I may come back up for air from time to time.
    Real life awaits and she is a demanding mistress.

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  5. #85
    Senior Member ColonelGadaafi's Avatar
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    A good suggestion to prevent prison rapes would be to segregate it completely based on their criminal records, psychological state, and basic profile(this has been done already in good prisons). Aswell as installing intricate and subtle network of surveillance that would heavily deterr and reduce their ability to escape prosecution for prison rapes, not just the one used to monitor hotspots and main sectors. This kind of thing i bet would reduce rape and prison violence amongst casual criminals for a pretty good amount, which constitute the majority of the prison population. This would be very costly... sure but it would be the most feasible solution that could be implemented. The other would be reintroducing medieval dungeon like housing for prisoners, that would prevent any ingoing crime, but again.
    "Where can you flee? What road will you use to escape us? Our horses are swift, our arrows sharp, our swords like thunderbolts, our hearts as hard as the mountains, our soldiers as numerous as the sand. Fortresses will not detain us, nor arms stop us. Your prayers to God will not avail against us. We are not moved by tears nor touched by lamentations."

  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by FireyPheonix View Post
    You know sex offenders almost invarible have a history of sexual abuse themselves (I mean the paedophiles etc).
    I believe there a fair amount of hysteria associated with paedophiles, but no-one ever seems to look at thier history etc. Some of them are no longer capable of healthy sexual relations. I do believe they are in need of compassion.
    That said, if any of the kiddy fiddlers went near any of my love ones, I would slit thier thoarts in the middle of the night while they were sleeping. No regrets, but endless torture...I could do it, but why?
    I remember reading an article about a convicted paedophile. He just couldn't help himself (I do believe he felt remorse and shame), in the end he took himself and his wife to a remote community where there were no children, in the middle of the NT in OZ. He tried to seek help...even submitted himself to various medical research trials and treatment. It was very hard to not to feel compassion for this man, perhaps because he was one of the few you hear about who actively sought to try and change. (he wasn't violent, I know it doesn't jusify it...)
    Truth is I believe they belong away from society, safe from themselves and safe for others.
    I definitely do agree with the final sentence and for a long time thought the idea of some sort of colony, like how lepers where once treated, would be a great idea.

    I dont believe that they are deserving of compassion, why? I think that too much in the way of compassion for strangers is already considered normative and I'm a socialist, I do think its only to be expected that people will care about who they know and who they are with and strangers really wont count as much. That's in general.

    Now specificially feeling compassionate for someone because they have been the victim of abuse and then become a perpetrator, No, under no circumstances, No, not ever.

    I dont know what the generative factors leading to pathological, or even situational/opportunistic, peadophilia are but I suspect they are a combination of recessive genes and environment. I've also read some interesting stuff about the importance of visual and sensory "imprinting" at moments when the brain is overwhelmed with neuro-chemicals, now this was in relation to heterosex and preference in particular partners for body shape and appearence but its probably transferable and outside of the field of sex some research has been done on how trauma can operate in a similar fashion. However none of that makes me feel compassion for someone, it can allow me to understand how they are the way they are but why should that automatically entail compassion?

    There's a danger in pathologising and medicalising all bad behaviour as illness, it only leaves people off guard when they should be considering the safety and welfare of the most vulnerable among their dependents. Predators count on this kind of thing and I'm even sure would sponsor or support its growth.

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColonelGadaafi View Post
    A good suggestion to prevent prison rapes would be to segregate it completely based on their criminal records, psychological state, and basic profile(this has been done already in good prisons). Aswell as installing intricate and subtle network of surveillance that would heavily deterr and reduce their ability to escape prosecution for prison rapes, not just the one used to monitor hotspots and main sectors. This kind of thing i bet would reduce rape and prison violence amongst casual criminals for a pretty good amount, which constitute the majority of the prison population. This would be very costly... sure but it would be the most feasible solution that could be implemented. The other would be reintroducing medieval dungeon like housing for prisoners, that would prevent any ingoing crime, but again.
    Why not go the whole hog and have chemical castration through the food supply?

  8. #88
    Senior Member ColonelGadaafi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Why not go the whole hog and have chemical castration through the food supply?
    I am going to bypass that rhetorical question and say, they already do crastrations openly to psychotic criminals and unsalvagable criminals and criminals who do not respond to therapy can have the option of taking sex hormone reducing drugs and castration, but its still only available to limited extent as a grave measure. The problem of solving this kind of issue is really just a matter of costs and feasbility.
    "Where can you flee? What road will you use to escape us? Our horses are swift, our arrows sharp, our swords like thunderbolts, our hearts as hard as the mountains, our soldiers as numerous as the sand. Fortresses will not detain us, nor arms stop us. Your prayers to God will not avail against us. We are not moved by tears nor touched by lamentations."

  9. #89
    lab rat extraordinaire CrystalViolet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I definitely do agree with the final sentence and for a long time thought the idea of some sort of colony, like how lepers where once treated, would be a great idea.

    I dont believe that they are deserving of compassion, why? I think that too much in the way of compassion for strangers is already considered normative and I'm a socialist, I do think its only to be expected that people will care about who they know and who they are with and strangers really wont count as much. That's in general.

    Now specificially feeling compassionate for someone because they have been the victim of abuse and then become a perpetrator, No, under no circumstances, No, not ever.

    I dont know what the generative factors leading to pathological, or even situational/opportunistic, peadophilia are but I suspect they are a combination of recessive genes and environment. I've also read some interesting stuff about the importance of visual and sensory "imprinting" at moments when the brain is overwhelmed with neuro-chemicals, now this was in relation to heterosex and preference in particular partners for body shape and appearence but its probably transferable and outside of the field of sex some research has been done on how trauma can operate in a similar fashion. However none of that makes me feel compassion for someone, it can allow me to understand how they are the way they are but why should that automatically entail compassion?

    There's a danger in pathologising and medicalising all bad behaviour as illness, it only leaves people off guard when they should be considering the safety and welfare of the most vulnerable among their dependents. Predators count on this kind of thing and I'm even sure would sponsor or support its growth.
    Ah, you mistake my feelings of compassion for mercy. No mercy. Not at all. But I don't believe in the death penality either. And only a fool would leave thier guard off around a paedophile.
    My compassion does extend to a man who knows he does wrong, but can't stop himself...a bit like a vegetrian cat, who kills the odd bird because he can't help himself. Reformed paedophiles don't exsist, like vegetarian cats don't exist.
    I may feel sorry for him and what lead him to that point, but for all that, it doesn't make me a soft touch. I feel just as much compassion, if not more for the victim. Justice should be served.
    Think of my compassion, as some thing, a disappointed parent must feel when their kid screws up big time. I feel for them, but they are a danger to society.
    Currently submerged under an avalanche of books and paper work. I may come back up for air from time to time.
    Real life awaits and she is a demanding mistress.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  10. #90
    lab rat extraordinaire CrystalViolet's Avatar
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    Post script.
    I think paedophiles should treated humanly, but isolated from the greater community.
    Chemical/pshyical castration doesn't work. It seems it's not exactly a sexual impulse. You can still voilate with hands.
    Currently submerged under an avalanche of books and paper work. I may come back up for air from time to time.
    Real life awaits and she is a demanding mistress.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

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