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  1. #11
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Words of Ivory View Post
    Noah's Ark is a fictional story. Nothing more.
    That's more than you can know for certain.

  2. #12
    You're fired. Lol. Antimony's Avatar
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    I haven't been following it, but isn't the one they found a fake??
    Excuse me, but does this smell like chloroform to you?

    Always reserve the right to become smarter at a future point in time, for only a fool limits themselves to all they knew in the past. -Alex

  3. #13
    facettes de la petite mor Words of Ivory's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    That's more than you can know for certain.
    It really isn't.

    Based on what the bible tells us, the kind of craftmanship required to build a boat that accomplished what the Ark did, alongside the amount of resources required for those animals to survive that long on top of that, is statistically impossible.

    If there was a "world flood", there would also be some geological evidence. Oh, but that's right, all humanity wasn't wiped off the face of the earth at any point in history. If it had been, it would have taken millions of years for us to repopulate. Based on the bible's recollection, it only happened about 5000 years ago.

    So yeah, I'm pretty certain.

    Quote Originally Posted by Antimony View Post
    I haven't been following it, but isn't the one they found a fake??
    Many have been "found" there, and all of them have been debunked.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    "Life calls out the meaning of pure jubilance,
    if you'll only take the time to hear it."
    ~ Words of Ivory ~

  4. #14
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Words of Ivory View Post
    It really isn't.

    Based on what the bible tells us, the kind of craftmanship required to build a boat that accomplished what the Ark did, alongside the amount of resources required for those animals to survive that long on top of that, is statistically impossible.

    If there was a "world flood", there would also be some geological evidence. Oh, but that's right, all humanity wasn't wiped off the face of the earth at any point in history. If it had been, it would have taken millions of years for us to repopulate. Based on the bible's recollection, it only happened about 5000 years ago.

    So yeah, I'm pretty certain.
    Based on your suppositions it seems unlikely; but your suppositions are not necessarily valid.

    The biblical account does not have to be correct in every detail for there to have been some genuine wooden artifact that gave rise to the Noah's Ark story. That same wooden artifact, if located in a cold, dry climate, could potentially last for thousands of years. Even if it did not, you cannot know that there never was such an artifact... which means that you cannot be certain that it's a "fictional story."

    All the major cultures have a flood story in their mythology. That emphatically does not imply that the Judeo-Christian God wiped the earth clean with floodwaters approximately 4,000 years ago... but it may indicate that there was some event that gave rise to story in the folklore.

    Nor would I assert that there absolutely was a Noah's Ark on this basis. I just understand the limits of my certainty... and I think you've exceeded yours.

  5. #15
    DoubleplusUngoodNonperson
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    Yeah ob's right on technical epistemological grounds. You cannot logically infer the non-existence of something based upon a lacking-ness of evidence. It would be better to say that its a story and there's no good indication that it's anything other than a story.

  6. #16
    Nips away your dignity Fluffywolf's Avatar
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    Like researchers say, if Noah's ark is based on a real event, it is much more likely to have been a small local flood and a fisherman's tale blown up.
    ~Self-depricating Megalomaniacal Superwolf

  7. #17

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    I'm with Oberon, great flood stories cut across all cultures so I believe there was an environmental cataclysm and there was an ark, whether it conforms perfectly to either the bible story or its interpretations since are another matter.

    To my mind its possible that it was a flooding of the "known world", it was a vessel big enough to save all the people and animals in that context too and being made of wood it wouldnt have survived. So far as relative dimensions so, perhaps it was a miraculously large vessel, perhaps it was divine intervention that created it, the fine details are not recorded and there's no passenger or boarding list.

    Given that that's the case I do believe there's a possibility that details have been embellished or numerology is at work, there are other stories such as the prophets or Job visiting settlements so large it took days and days to cross them or the ages which leaders and prophets lived to, well into the hundreds of years.

    I dont believe this present find is "The" ark because if it where then its been found half a dozen times already. Why's this politics BTW?

  8. #18
    facettes de la petite mor Words of Ivory's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I'm with Oberon, great flood stories cut across all cultures so I believe there was an environmental cataclysm and there was an ark, whether it conforms perfectly to either the bible story or its interpretations since are another matter.
    Most religions have a creation story as well. That doesn't mean that they're based in fact.

    In the case of most western religions, they simply derive their beliefs from earlier religions. It has nothing to do with historical relevance.

    If there's a Noah's Ark, it's a goddamn fishing boat that got caught in high tide, whose owner ate too many medicinal herbs.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    "Life calls out the meaning of pure jubilance,
    if you'll only take the time to hear it."
    ~ Words of Ivory ~

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Words of Ivory View Post
    Most religions have a creation story as well. That doesn't mean that they're based in fact.

    In the case of most western religions, they simply derive their beliefs from earlier religions. It has nothing to do with historical relevance.

    If there's a Noah's Ark, it's a goddamn fishing boat that got caught in high tide, whose owner ate too many medicinal herbs.
    Your final point is interesting, if it wherent for the delivery appearing insulting to me I may give it more consideration and it has a kind of superficial appeal as credible to someone raised my culture and time.

    The thing about the religions is that I'm prepared to believe that perhaps they are composed from perrenial archetypes and emanations like those investigated and studied by Jung with the insights provided by psychology.

    However, I dont believe they are derivative in the literary sense or fictive or inventions.

  10. #20
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Words of Ivory View Post
    In the case of most western religions, they simply derive their beliefs from earlier religions. It has nothing to do with historical relevance.
    I think I'm safe in saying that the book of Genesis is from the Judaic tradition... correct me if I'm wrong.

    What pre-Judaic religion is it said that Judaism derived the flood story from?

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