User Tag List

First 5678 Last

Results 61 to 70 of 73

  1. #61
    Senior Member Sandy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Posts
    552

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    I have a strangely similar idea in spite of my extremely different political views. I want national healthcare, but I thought that in order to take some weight off of the system and provide to those in need, all registered drug users should get cut-off from healthcare.
    They can come back any time they clean up. All is forgiven.
    You see, I don't think drug users should be arrested either. I don't want them costing money in any way, shape, or form.

    *sigh*. I have the kind of ideas that make blue states and red states hate me.
    I don't hate you!
    -Sandy
    I - 75% N - 55% F - 55% P - 61%
    Enneagram 4w5

    There is love... in the red letters
    There is truth... in the red letters

  2. #62
    Senior Member Sandy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Posts
    552

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    I have a strangely similar idea in spite of my extremely different political views. I want national healthcare, but I thought that in order to take some weight off of the system and provide to those in need, all registered drug users should get cut-off from healthcare.
    They can come back any time they clean up. All is forgiven.
    You see, I don't think drug users should be arrested either. I don't want them costing money in any way, shape, or form.

    *sigh*. I have the kind of ideas that make blue states and red states hate me.
    Oh, and before I finally had enough of his shenanigans and divorced him, my ex-husband decided to go through a drug rehab through my health insurance TWICE... it was very expensive, and I had to pay 20% (at that time) and he wasn't working. It still didn't work. I was so bummed.
    -Sandy
    I - 75% N - 55% F - 55% P - 61%
    Enneagram 4w5

    There is love... in the red letters
    There is truth... in the red letters

  3. #63
    Senior Member Sandy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Posts
    552

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kelric View Post
    I'd disagree with the fact that the current batch of "conservatives" (I'd not argue if you say that you, as a conservative, disagree with them) think that they shouldn't be as involved in your life, and the life of your family. For the most part, the difference between the "left" and "right" political spectrum in the U.S. currently has nothing to do with *how* they want to interfere in the lives of people - they just want to butt in on different issues (due to my biases, I see the republicans as *far* worse in this regard, but I can understand why folks with other viewpoints could see the opposite).

    I certainly wouldn't say that the current administration supports a strengthening of checks and balances - Bush is almost certainly the worst abuser of our system of checks and balances in recent memory. Whoever gets elected in any Federal election, this needs to change.

    To what end? Just curious - there's a big difference between a nation prepared to defend itself (my bet is almost everyone likes this investment in the military), and a nation interested in projecting military power elsewhere in the world to push the agenda of business interests.

    Agreed - there's certainly room for compassion, but as long as there are avenues for people to immigrate legally, that's the route that should be taken. Note that legal immigrants also aren't as easily exploited - another thing to consider.

    You're right - life's not fair, and working hard to get ahead isn't a bad thing. But there is some sort of social support net that needs to exist - people with no choices do desperate things, and I have far more faith in government, which is at least nominally accountable to the people, than private institutions to administer aid fairly. If social programs are used to increase the lowest common denominator of quality of life to a point where anyone has a realistic chance to pursue their dreams (I believe we're not at this point now), that's a good thing for society as a whole. The problem, of course, is corruption and pork. No perfect answers from me, but I side on the end of more social services (and absolutely for a single-payer medical coverage system).

    Preferring lower taxes and lower spending on services makes you a conservative. Preferring higher taxes and higher spending on services makes me a liberal. Both are reasonable fiscal policies. Lower taxes and higher spending, like Bush (and he's far from alone in blame for this) is simply stupid long-term fiscal policy (although it can get you elected, unfortunately). Not an issue of him being "more liberal" than you are - it's just bad fiscal policy.

    It does - thanks for responding. It's pretty clear that neither of us is going to convince the other of much, but that's ok . Reasonable people can disagree, especially when the issues are complex (but I still think I'm right ).

    Having said all that, I appear to have driven this thread even farther off track, and for that I apologize. I'll try to restrain myself from continuing to do so.
    I was spitting mad after 9/11 (and it's a good thing I wasn't the president because my reaction was to over-react - President Bush was far more level-headed than I was). The thing is, I wish I had all the answers, but unfortunately, I don't. I just hope to keep learning and keep growing.

    I am glad that we can agree to disagree, and I apologize starting this whole thread derailment. *embarrassed*
    -Sandy
    I - 75% N - 55% F - 55% P - 61%
    Enneagram 4w5

    There is love... in the red letters
    There is truth... in the red letters

  4. #64
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Enneagram
    827 sp/so
    Posts
    20,123

    Default

    you didn't start it Sandy!
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  5. #65

    Default

    Wow, a lot to digest...

    If nothing else, this thread gives me hope by demonstrating that Americans have myriad political beliefs. Not everyone (or even most people) are "red" or "blue". In itself, that is encouraging.

    I'm also noticing that many political terms have different meanings in different parts of the world. In fact, many of these terms have had different meanings over the course of American history. Today's Democratic party used to be called the Republican party when it was founded by Thomas Jefferson, et al.

    It seems to me that this has caused a fair bit of animosity on the thread thus far. Wolf's definition of "liberal" seems to fit how the term is used in US politics today, while Whatever's definition seems to be more classical in nature. As an example, I think that liberal politics in the US today can definitely be called authoritarian. Any philosophy that would take decisions out of the hands of the citizenry for their own good because their benevolent government "knows better" is rightly called authoritarian. In fact, a case can be made (though I won't make it) that the Republicans under Bush are "liberal" because of their hands-off attitude toward reducing the disparity between rich and poor. I guess to simplify, you can look at "liberal" and "conservative" as words with proper definitions, or as political terms that have meanings apart from their dictionary definition.

    To completely change topics, I think the general dislike for Hillary Clinton among the electorate has nothing to do with the fact that she is a woman. I think it is because she doesn't stand for anything. She's a windsock. She moved to New York because she calculated that it was the state where she was most likely to be elected senator. Then she wore Yankees AND Mets caps depending on who she was speaking to (don't dismiss this as meaningless...it shows that the message is different for different audiences.) And now she cries because people like Obama better. People don't like her specifically because she so desperately craves approval and isn't above carpetbagging to get it. It really has nothing to do with her political credentials, which are generally solid. It's about personal integrity.

    Personally, I like Obama best right now, followed by Edwards. I liked Richardson a lot, but that doesn't matter now. Huckabee scares me because he's a little too Christian. The guy I really want to vote for is 2004 McCain, but he doesn't exist anymore. 2008 McCain is Bush with a fresh coat of paint. The guy sold out.

    But don't listen to me, I'm an avowed conservative that's voted Democrat in three of the last four elections

  6. #66
    only bites when provoked
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Posts
    2,127

    Default

    FMWarner: You got whatever and I mixed up.
    I 100%, N 88%, T 88%, J 75%

    Disclaimer: The above is my opinion and mine alone, it does not mean I cannot change my mind, nor does it guarantee that my comments are related to any deep-seated convictions. Take everything I say with a whole snowplow worth of salt and call me in the morning, if you can.

  7. #67
    Permabanned
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    ExTJ
    Posts
    1,377

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FMWarner View Post
    To completely change topics, I think the general dislike for Hillary Clinton among the electorate has nothing to do with the fact that she is a woman. I think it is because she doesn't stand for anything. She's a windsock. She moved to New York because she calculated that it was the state where she was most likely to be elected senator. Then she wore Yankees AND Mets caps depending on who she was speaking to (don't dismiss this as meaningless...it shows that the message is different for different audiences.) And now she cries because people like Obama better. People don't like her specifically because she so desperately craves approval and isn't above carpetbagging to get it. It really has nothing to do with her political credentials, which are generally solid. It's about personal integrity.
    The dislike for Hillary Clinton seems to have gone back awhile, to when Bill Clinton was president, and from what I've heard of from then (being really young didn't help in understanding what was going on.), a lot of the dislike had to do with issues of male vs. female. Nowadays, it seems to be a combination of things, including what you described, some male/female stuff left over from the last decade, some scandal issues left over from the last decade, and random other issues.

  8. #68

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Zergling View Post
    The dislike for Hillary Clinton seems to have gone back awhile, to when Bill Clinton was president, and from what I've heard of from then (being really young didn't help in understanding what was going on.), a lot of the dislike had to do with issues of male vs. female. Nowadays, it seems to be a combination of things, including what you described, some male/female stuff left over from the last decade, some scandal issues left over from the last decade, and random other issues.
    I think the dislike of Hillary Clinton left over from Bill's administration has more to do with her various statements ("when we were elected") that indicated her feeling that she and Bill were kind of co-presidents. That really rubbed people the wrong way, because no one had voted for her. I voted for Bill Clinton in that first election, and I know that I felt that way, too. I think that is only a male/female thing by coincidence. I don't think it was specifically because she is a woman.

  9. #69

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolf View Post
    FMWarner: You got whatever and I mixed up.
    After rereading, I think I got it right, but apologies if I did not.

  10. #70
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Enneagram
    827 sp/so
    Posts
    20,123

    Default

    sorry FM- I was arguing the modern definition and wolf was arguing classical!
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

Similar Threads

  1. 2016 primary and caucus predictions thread
    By SearchingforPeace in forum Politics, History, and Current Events
    Replies: 687
    Last Post: 07-24-2016, 10:05 PM
  2. 'Ambiverts' - relative strength of primary and secondary function
    By annnie in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 08-31-2010, 07:41 PM
  3. About primary and secondary functions in combination
    By Kita in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 03-26-2010, 02:45 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO