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  1. #31
    What is, is. Arthur Schopenhauer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    "People won't do more drugs if they are sterile. They'll do what they otherwise would have done, and the effects will be less deleterious."

    I thought that was pretty clear. They'll do the same amount of drugs they always did, but they won't have to steal or walk the streets for money, and they won't be getting sick nearly as often.
    Well, that's all relative to each individual.
    INTJ | 5w4 - Sp/Sx/So | 5-4-(9/1) | RLoEI | Melancholic-Choleric | Johari & Nohari

    This will not end well...
    But it will at least be poetic, I suppose...

    Hmm... But what if it does end well?
    Then I suppose it will be a different sort of poetry, a preferable sort...
    A sort I could become accustomed to...



  2. #32
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentMind View Post
    Well, that's all relative to each individual.
    No, not really. They've done extensive studies about this. Do you think people will start smoking more weed if they make it legal? There would be maybe two months where people don't do shit but smoke weed, then it would go back to normal, and we'd all be much better off.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  3. #33
    What is, is. Arthur Schopenhauer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    No, not really. They've done extensive studies about this. Do you think people will start smoking more weed if they make it legal? There would be maybe two months where people don't do shit but smoke weed, then it would go back to normal, and we'd all be much better off.
    They would smoke more weed, yes. It would be cheaper and more available and the stigma would be removed. Secondly, more people would begin smoking it.
    INTJ | 5w4 - Sp/Sx/So | 5-4-(9/1) | RLoEI | Melancholic-Choleric | Johari & Nohari

    This will not end well...
    But it will at least be poetic, I suppose...

    Hmm... But what if it does end well?
    Then I suppose it will be a different sort of poetry, a preferable sort...
    A sort I could become accustomed to...



  4. #34
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentMind View Post
    They would smoke more weed, yes. It would be cheaper and more available and the stigma would be removed. Secondly, more people would begin smoking it.
    You're out of your mind.

    A) There is not much of a stigma with marijuana to begin with;

    B) Cheaper and more available = less potheads' budget going to weed, not more use

    C) NO ONE says, "You know, I would smoke pot except that it's illegal. If it ever were, I totally would."


    And look at the historical parallels. Do you think alcoholism went down during Prohibition? Of course not. And lots of people were murdered or died/went blind from bad booze.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  5. #35
    Senior Member matmos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    What other people are being affected, other than the taxpayers who will foot the bill?
    Even with the taxpayer footing the bill, it's probably much cheaper to prescribe free heroin; the cost should more than be offset by savings on insurance premiums to pay for the damage a small, hardcore of these users cause. The study in Switzerland is trying to establish this, among other things.

    And the Swiss aren't the only ones that think the policy pursued by the US is costly, ineffective and keeps the drug barons in business.

    Outside Switzerland, the Dutch are about to embark on their own modest experiment with heroin prescription. The Australians, who recently conducted an extensive feasibility study, seem likely to start a heroin-prescription program. In Germany, officials in Frankfurt, Hamburg, Karlsruhe, Stuttgart, and elsewhere are seeking permission from the central government to begin their own heroin prescription projects.
    From Switzerland's Heroin Experiment

    The only argument against widescale legalisation I've heard was that the king pins would migrate towards more serious stuff like kidnapping.

  6. #36
    What is, is. Arthur Schopenhauer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    A) There is not much of a stigma with marijuana to begin with;
    Sure there is. Don't forget that we're talking primarily about heroin, which also has a stigma attached to it. Drugs are primarily portrayed as negative and unhealthy, and this is the vision of the current majority, I believe. "Not much of a stigma" is certainly a stigma, so I don't see your point.

    B) Cheaper and more available = less potheads' budget going to weed, not more use
    If a good is cheaper it will be used and purchased more often than a good that is more expensive. This is simple.

    C) NO ONE says, "You know, I would smoke pot except that it's illegal. If it ever were, I totally would."
    I'm certain that there are at least a few people who would do weed if it was legalized; you're dipping into hyperbole and it's ugly. Secondly, if weed became legal it would be more available and therefore more people would be using it.

    And look at the historical parallels. Do you think alcoholism went down during Prohibition? Of course not. And lots of people were murdered or died/went blind from bad booze.
    We're talking about legalizing something not criminalizing it. Perhaps this is a good point but I don't see how it fits into our conversation - for instance, if we were to lower the drinking age, more people would be drinking alcohol. Perhaps I'm incorrect, it just makes sense to me.
    INTJ | 5w4 - Sp/Sx/So | 5-4-(9/1) | RLoEI | Melancholic-Choleric | Johari & Nohari

    This will not end well...
    But it will at least be poetic, I suppose...

    Hmm... But what if it does end well?
    Then I suppose it will be a different sort of poetry, a preferable sort...
    A sort I could become accustomed to...



  7. #37
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagnificentMind View Post
    Sure there is. Don't forget that we're talking primarily about heroin, which also has a stigma attached to it. Drugs are primarily portrayed as negative and unhealthy, and this is the vision of the current majority, I believe. "Not much of a stigma" is certainly a stigma, so I don't see your point.
    Marijuana? It's the most widely used illegal drug in the world, and it has a very good chance at being legalized in California. There is more of a stigma about heavy alcohol use than moderate marijuana use in much of the country. How many people think pot is highly negative? That's silly.


    If a good is cheaper it will be used and purchased more often than a good that is more expensive. This is simple.
    Not when it goes from being illegal to legal. Criminalizing drugs is a market distortion that disrupts the normal function of supply and demand. Some people will use more, others will use less (now that small, cheap amounts will be widely available, regular users won't have to purchase large amounts to have stashes in case supply is cut off), and most will use the same amount. You clearly have not thought this through much.


    I'm certain that there are at least a few people who would do weed if it was legalized; you're dipping into hyperbole and it's ugly. Secondly, if weed became legal it would be more available and therefore more people would be using it.
    That really isn't hyperbole. Why on Earth would someone who wouldn't otherwise smoke weed do it if it were legal? You're not using common sense.


    We're talking about legalizing something not criminalizing it. Perhaps this is a good point but I don't see how it fits into our conversation - for instance, if we were to lower the drinking age, more people would be drinking alcohol. Perhaps I'm incorrect, it just makes sense to me.
    You are completely and totally incorrect.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  8. #38
    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Heroin, be the death of me
    Heroin, it's my wife and it's my life
    Because a mainer to my vein
    Leads to a center in my head
    And then I'm better off than dead
    Because when the smack begins to flow
    I really don't care anymore
    About all the Jim-Jim's in this town
    And all the politicians makin' busy sounds
    And everybody puttin' everybody else down
    And all the dead bodies piled up in mounds

    'Cause when the smack begins to flow
    Then I really don't care anymore
    Ah, when the heroin is in my blood
    And that blood is in my head
    Then thank God that I'm as good as dead
    Then thank your God that I'm not aware
    And thank God that I just don't care
    And I guess I just don't know
    And I guess I just don't know

    "Heroin" by the Velvet Underground.
    Last edited by Nonsensical; 07-27-2010 at 09:20 PM.
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

  9. #39
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneWithSoul View Post
    Heroin, be the death of me
    Heroin, it's my wife and it's my life
    Because a mainer to my vein
    Leads to a center in my head
    And then I'm better off than dead
    Because when the smack begins to flow
    I really don't care anymore
    About all the Jim-Jim's in this town
    And all the politicians makin' busy sounds
    And everybody puttin' everybody else down
    And all the dead bodies piled up in mounds

    'Cause when the smack begins to flow
    Then I really don't care anymore
    Ah, when the heroin is in my blood
    And that blood is in my head
    Then thank God that I'm as good as dead
    Then thank your God that I'm not aware
    And thank God that I just don't care
    And I guess I just don't know
    And I guess I just don't know

    "Heroine" by the Velvet Underground.

    You have the whole song with the drug spelled correctly, then put "Heroine" at the end?
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  10. #40
    What is, is. Arthur Schopenhauer's Avatar
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    I'm done with this thread. Best of luck.
    INTJ | 5w4 - Sp/Sx/So | 5-4-(9/1) | RLoEI | Melancholic-Choleric | Johari & Nohari

    This will not end well...
    But it will at least be poetic, I suppose...

    Hmm... But what if it does end well?
    Then I suppose it will be a different sort of poetry, a preferable sort...
    A sort I could become accustomed to...



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