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Thread: Guns!

  1. #1
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Default Guns!

    McDonald v. Chicago came down from the Supes today. Incorporates the Second Amendment under the Heller v. District of Columbia standard, which recognizes guns possessed for self-defense as a fundamental right.

    Any thoughts?

    Edit: sorry for the legalese. "Incorporates" means that a portion of the Bill of Rights applies to the states via the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment.

  2. #2
    Oberon
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    This appears to me to be a fair reading of Amendment 2. I've always thought it foolish that people would claim that all the amendments in the Bill of Rights applied to individuals except for the Second, which applied to states. C'mon folks... read it. I think the SCOTUS got this one correct.

    Now, with regard to whether it's actually a good idea for individuals to have a right to be armed... that's an entirely different question.

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    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Criminals will arm themselves whether the right to do so exists or not.

    Personally, I like having the option of blowing their head off if they trespass on my property or try to harm me or my loved ones.

    At this point in U.S. history it would be impossible to disarm the nation.

    An armed citizenry is a good check and balance against would be tyrants in a government gone bad...

    I'm a military kid, so maybe I'm biased, but that's my take on this issue.
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  4. #4
    Oberon
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    Well, Halla, I don't actually favor blowing the heads off of people just for tresspassing. My sense of territorialism isn't quite that strong. However, I am all about defending family and loved ones with force, deadly force if need be.

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    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Well, Halla, I don't actually favor blowing the heads off of people just for tresspassing. My sense of territorialism isn't quite that strong.
    My remark was kind of a joke.

    "Kind of" in that if I wake up at 2 AM to find some dude rooting through my house I am going to shoot him before he has a chance to shoot/stab me.

    But, if some vaccuum cleaner salesman ended up in my front yard they are safe from harm, but will get read the riot act.

    I have a hard time believing that anyone who is inside your residence uninvited has your best interest at heart.

    Whether an intruder is inside or outside of your house is a defining element in the decision as to whether or not they should be shot, IMO.

    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    However, I am all about defending family and loved ones with force, deadly force if need be.
    Yes, I am 100% about this.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    McDonald v. Chicago came down from the Supes today. Incorporates the Second Amendment under the Heller v. District of Columbia standard, which recognizes guns possessed for self-defense as a fundamental right.

    Any thoughts?
    And sure, the right to bear arms should be included in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

    It is becoming plain that the Universal Declaration of Human Rights is not only deficient but downright un-American.

    We know all the others want to be American and free and that is why we should amend the Universal Declaration of Human Rights to include the fundamental right to bear arms.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Well, Halla, I don't actually favor blowing the heads off of people just for tresspassing. My sense of territorialism isn't quite that strong. However, I am all about defending family and loved ones with force, deadly force if need be.
    I think part of the reason people seem more territorial today is because they don't know their neighbors. They aren't engaged in the community.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  8. #8
    Oberon
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    Victor, I want you to know that I fully, totally, and passionately support your God-given right to not own firearms if you don't want to.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Victor, I want you to know that I fully, totally, and passionately support your God-given right to not own firearms if you don't want to.
    Thank you dear Oberon for your passionate support for me but I would prefer your passionate support for the democratic right of my Government to ban guns.

    And further, I would like to hear your passionate support for the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

  10. #10
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Thank you dear Oberon for your passionate support for me but I would prefer your passionate support for the democratic right of my Government to ban guns.

    And further, I would like to hear your passionate support for the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.
    I disagree with the premise that a free people should ever be barred the use of arms, Victor. However, should a majority of your population support pursuing this folly, your government certainly has the practical wherewithal to proceed... and has done so, if I'm not mistaken.

    As for the UDHR... I'm afraid that would be off-topic in this thread. I recommend you start another one.

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