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  1. #111
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    Dare I ask on what basis you make this argument?
    The Bible is (allegedly) divine.

    I usually don't like citing movies, but Richard Burton's protrayal of St. Thomas Becket sums it up: "The Kingdom of God must be defended like any other Kingdom. Do you think that Right has only to show its handsome face for everything to drop in its lap? Without Might, its old enemy, Right counts for nothing."
    This is such a bad argument. You're not part of the Kingdom of God. You're a human hoping to become part of it after you die. Defend it after you're dead.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  2. #112
    Sniffles
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    The Bible is (allegedly) divine.
    The divine origins of Scriptures is not what I asked. I asked you on what basis do you say that Just War doctrine is not compatible with the Bible, but rather stuff people made up later.

    This is such a bad argument. You're not part of the Kingdom of God. You're a human hoping to become part of it after you die. Defend it after you're dead.
    Uh huh - keep talking!

  3. #113
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    You're not part of the Kingdom of God. You're a human hoping to become part of it after you die. Defend it after you're dead.
    Your understanding of Christian orthodoxy on this point is poor.

  4. #114
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    The divine origins of Scriptures is not what I asked. I asked you on what basis do you say that Just War doctrine is not compatible with the Bible, but rather stuff people made up later.
    It's not an issue of whether or not it's compatible (an infinite number of possible "doctrines" are compatible). It's whether or not the Bible makes these statements, explicitly, and it doesn't. This Just War doctrine is stuff people made up after the fact.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  5. #115
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Your understanding of Christian orthodoxy on this point is poor.
    No one knows whether or not they are going to heaven while they are still alive.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  6. #116
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    No one knows whether or not they are going to heaven while they are still alive.
    You're on untenable ground, L. Please stop trying to defend yourself on this point. It just makes you look foolish.

  7. #117
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    You're on untenable ground, L. Please stop trying to defend yourself on this point. It just makes you look foolish.
    What is wrong with my last statement?
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  8. #118
    Oberon
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    You're conflating entry into heaven with being part of the Kingdom of God. They are by no means the same thing.

  9. #119
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    You're conflating entry into heaven with being part of the Kingdom of God. They are by no means the same thing.
    Are people who go to Hell part of the Kingdom of God?
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  10. #120
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    Are people who go to Hell part of the Kingdom of God?
    The Kingdom of God is composed of all who acknowledge God as their King. That is why Jesus and his cousin John preached "The Kingdom of God is at hand" repeatedly. The message was not "Behave and you can go to heaven"; the message was "You can serve the Lord God and be part of His Kingdom right now."

    That's why the Kingdom of God and entry into heaven are not the same thing.

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