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  1. #61
    Furry Critter with Claws Kiddo's Avatar
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    One thing in particular that troubles me about Ron Paul is the degree he is willing to take his government cutbacks. He doesn't say he is going to just cut back on spending and change the way things are done on the Federal level, he says he is going to eliminate them. IRS, Department of Education, UNICEF, etc.; all gone! I can understand decreasing the burden of the bureaucracy, but we are talking about tens of thousands of government jobs that he is willing to eradicate. How does unemployment help anyone? Well maybe it helps big business who can then cut wages and benefits as formerly government employed and highly qualified job hunters flood the job market. If Ron Paul can show me there will be jobs waiting for the thousands he would be willing to lay off, then I would be much happier with his ideology. It's one thing to acknowledge that such a thing would take time, but quite another to follow through with it patiently. This would be a process that would take decades of concerted effort, and I worry he would get into office and simply cut the budget on these programs, sending the country into hell.

  2. #62
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    This would be a process that would take decades of concerted effort, and I worry he would get into office and simply cut the budget on these programs, sending the country into hell.
    Realistically speaking, I think that's impossible. Clintonesque executive orders notwithstanding, the President does not rule by decree, particularly where the budget is concerned.

  3. #63
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    If 100 people are being paid to dig and fill a hole, over and over again, at the expense of taxpayers, then an increase of 100 people to the unemployment statistics is a good thing.

    Increasing unemployment is not a categorically bad thing. Rather, it is necessary to look toward the causes of employment. If I am not mistaken, communist nations have a habit to touting their 100% employment rates, despite delivering poverty to the vast majority of the population. In such a case, an increase in unemployment rates would be a good thing, and allow people to be redirected to jobs where they could actually be productive, rather than be carried on the backs of what others achieve.
    A criticism that can be brought against everything ought not to be brought against anything.

  4. #64
    Oberon
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    Reminds me of the old joke, nocturne:

    "The new economic policies have generated a hundred thousand new jobs."
    "Yes, I know... I have three of them!"

    ...which of course represents the opposite problem to what you describe, but nevertheless...

  5. #65
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    If I became king of the world tomorrow (which I may, supposing my dastardly plot comes to fruition), then I would intentionally increase unemployment immediately. Not, I stress, because I like people to be unemployed, but because there are too many people digging and filling holes.
    A criticism that can be brought against everything ought not to be brought against anything.

  6. #66
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    I would hate to see someone like Ron Paul in charge during the Great Depression...
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  7. #67
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    Kiddo,

    It would take me all day to disentangle the web of wrongness you just wrote, and unfortunately I do not have all day, nor the inclination. Suffice to say, you're wrong... oh so very wrong, not just on the specifics, but in the framing of the problem and available responses. In fact, this thread rivals that one about faith and the brain, in that it is so overflowing at the brim with really bad arguments that my head might explode. That said, don't give up, we were all stupid once, most of all me.
    A criticism that can be brought against everything ought not to be brought against anything.

  8. #68
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Most of the Libertarian assumptions are based on unproven ideas about what works better.
    Most of the Libertarian distinctives (not "assumptions") are based on old, tried-and-true ideas about what works better, but they're assumed to be unproven ideas by those who are ignorant of history.

  9. #69
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    I would hate to see someone like Ron Paul in charge during the Great Depression...
    Why?

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Why?
    Well, because FDR reversed the depression trend with such time-honoured policies as burning livestock, and paying people to dig holes... and then fill them again... without checking to see whether digging and filling holes was in high demand... because, y'know, that's always a good way to make people prosperous... erm.

    It improved the unemployment statistics at least, and that is categorically good, right?
    A criticism that can be brought against everything ought not to be brought against anything.

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