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  1. #11
    Guerilla Urbanist Brendan's Avatar
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    This is abhorrent on a few points:

    1) A doctor is lying to his or her patient.

    2) It allows the circumvention of the law.

    3) This could have serious, possibly fatal consequences for mother and/or child.

    4) The doctor could choose to tell the mother of the birth defects only after she has passed the window of opportunity to abort. I'm under the impression that a woman has until the third trimester to abort. Isn't this a tad late to start any needed prenatal care? Not to mention it's rather cruel to the parents. Not even because a woman has indicated that she would abort (which isn't a justification for this law anyway), this is all because the doctor suspects she may consider it!

    "Well everything looks great, you'll be having you're baby in three months, oh by the way, the child will probably be mentally handicapped. Best get crackin' on researching how to care for such a child. Congratulations!"
    There is no such thing as separation from God.

  2. #12
    Guerilla Urbanist Brendan's Avatar
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    Just sent this article to a friend who responded:

    "You know what this says to me? Don't live in Oklahoma."
    There is no such thing as separation from God.

  3. #13
    Guerilla Urbanist Brendan's Avatar
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    ...Seriously, Jeffster?

    Seriously?

    It's a law that says doctors can commit malpractice without fear of being sued for malpractice.
    Last edited by Bellflower; 05-03-2010 at 04:24 PM. Reason: removed deleted material
    There is no such thing as separation from God.

  4. #14
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Sort of OT to the specific situation, but very relevant to the doctor-to-patient deception issue:

    Has anyone read the latest annual medical review on more recent placebo studies? There are some great reasons to be pro-doctor-to-patient deception because of the mind-body interactions that have, very literally, doubled terminal patients' healthy last days/weeks/months. Never before have I heard someone advocate lying about the state of biological affairs or the prognosis, but instead this cited placebo treatments--because believing one has a resource on their side even when there aren't any biological agents combating the disease genuinely affects the brain chemistry/HPA axis/cortisol and other toxic effects, allowing the body to use itself as a resource.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
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  5. #15
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    So does the placebo effect cure birth defects? Because that'd be freaking amazing.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  6. #16
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    So does the placebo effect cure birth defects? Because that'd be freaking amazing.
    Unfortunately, no. But I agree--it would be freaking amazing!
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  7. #17
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    This is the most disgusting thing I've read all week...

    Why even bother to presume people are going to abort? How about the months and months it takes for paperwork to be processed for government aids for families with defected children? Or finding out all the information necessary to take on the responsibilities of these children? Support groups? Not only did they think their baby was fine, but it turns out the doctor lied, the baby is not, and they're out of pocket a LOT more money, instantly, than they ever dreamed of while trying to desperately scramble for information they need to even start to get help in this area. It's effectively turned a happy day into a tragedy and ticking stress bomb.

    Disgusting. All because people FEEL like things should be their way, because their way HAS to be the right way.. damned be to people and rights, as long as they get things their way. Fucking sick children that never grew up. Punish everyone because we're going to ASSUME that people may or may not abort a baby.
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
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  8. #18
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Similar-ish situation in Canada from Globe & Mail reporting:

    They're thinking of mandating Canadian physicians to withhold the sex of a pregnant parents' unborn baby until it's past the abortion date. It's with the intent of curbing the (apparently globally prevalent) abortions arising because parents still prefer boy babies to girls.

    I am pro-withholding sex info for both pragmatic reasons, i.e. China-like ratio problems, and ethical reasons--if the parents want an abortion, it should be because they don't want a child at that time.

    Canadians seem to be pro-withholding sex info. This would show that Canadian society is moving towards gender equality--though we're clearly not there yet because we still have abortions stemming from gender alone. I don't think we're moving towards physiological equality, though. In fact I think we're moving away from it.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  9. #19
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    ^ I am unsure on my feelings for that. If someone were going to need a particular sex so desperately, why not just do the thing where they pick out the particular sperm the want and insert it that carries the Y chromosome?
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
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  10. #20
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    ^ I am unsure on my feelings for that. If someone were going to need a particular sex so desperately, why not just do the thing where they pick out the particular sperm the want and insert it that carries the Y chromosome?
    They don't need it. It just shows that males are still valued more than females in our society. Similarly, in this situation, physiologically healthy babies are valued more than babies with birth defects.

    It's the same concept. A few rungs difference on the ladder of values, but the same concept.

    I think there's plenty of ethical reasons to defend the Louisiana ruling.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

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