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  1. #101
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    I don't know a single person of any political persuasion irl that was pro-bail-out.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  2. #102
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    I don't know a single person of any political persuasion irl that was pro-bail-out.
    A good friend of mine who was a Wharton student and politically disinterested (although he considered himself a Clinton Democrat) was completely radicalized to being a Mises-quoting hardcore Austrian economics/geolibertarianism fan based on A) working for Morgan Stanley; and B) the bailouts. He could not believe the collusion between Wall Street and the federal government.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  3. #103
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Really? You think social conservatives are reliable when it comes to the free market? I sure don't. Look at the Bush Administration. Or Pat Buchanan and Co. Or Mike Huckabee. Or any on the religious right who were pro-bailouts.
    You're talking about politicians. I'm not. I don't know a single conservative who was pro-bailout (excluding politicians).
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  4. #104
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    You're talking about politicians. I'm not. I don't know a single conservative who was pro-bailout (excluding politicians).
    I know a few California Republicans who were pro-bailout, but they aren't super-conservative types. Of course, the bailouts are extremely unpopular amongst people across the spectrum.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  5. #105
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    I know a few California Republicans who were pro-bailout, but they aren't super-conservative types. Of course, the bailouts are extremely unpopular amongst people across the spectrum.
    Like I said earlier, I don't think you know what you're talking about here. I doubt you've had much interaction with these types of people, if you've had any at all.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    Like I said earlier, I don't think you know what you're talking about here. I doubt you've had much interaction with these types of people, if you've had any at all.
    With religious wackos? Most people I know are not, but I know some very religious and socially conservative Catholics and Jews. Many of them are Democrats and not particularly big fans of free markets, actually. And, of course, I met a few conservatarian types at the Ron Paul rally and FFF conference (anti-bailout folks). The one group of people I found to be pretty consistently religious AND pro-free market were the Heritage Foundation donors I called when I was doing phone fundraising for nonprofits. A few random paleoconservative types or just complete weirdos (including one disgusting racist). The vast majority of these people were not going on any type of religious ranting. A couple of Birthers and "Obama's a crypto-fascist socialist communist!" types who were totally bummed around the inauguration. Are you trying to tell me that every social conservative you've ever met is pro-free market? I find that highly unlikely. Where do you live again?
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  7. #107
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    With religious wackos? Most people I know are not, but I know some very religious and socially conservative Catholics and Jews. Many of them are Democrats and not particularly big fans of free markets, actually. And, of course, I met a few conservatarian types at the Ron Paul rally and FFF conference (anti-bailout folks). The one group of people I found to be pretty consistently religious AND pro-free market were the Heritage Foundation donors I called when I was doing phone fundraising for nonprofits. A few random paleoconservative types or just complete weirdos (including one disgusting racist). The vast majority of these people were not going on any type of religious ranting. A couple of Birthers and "Obama's a crypto-fascist socialist communist!" types who were totally bummed around the inauguration. Are you trying to tell me that every social conservative you've ever met is pro-free market? I find that highly unlikely. Where do you live again?
    I wouldn't say that all social conservatives I've met are right wingers, but a vast majority have been. I've lived in the Midwest and Florida for most of my life.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  8. #108
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    The Tea Parties that I've been to were occupied mostly with wealthy/well-off, over-30, religious, white people. I agree with the general argument against high taxes and large government but I don't see how they can compare themselves with the original American revolutionaries.

    Modern Tea Party: moan/bitch about taxes in peaceful rallies after the highest tax rates have reached beyond 20%.

    First Tea Party: Commit acts of sedition and economic sabotage over a 1% tax.

    Big difference.
    “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I’m here to tell you that fast is better. I’ve always believed this, in spite of the trouble it’s caused me. Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba…”


  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    I wouldn't say that all social conservatives I've met are right wingers, but a vast majority have been. I've lived in the Midwest and Florida for most of my life.
    Well, that could account for it. I haven't had as much day-to-day contact with evangelical Protestants from the Midwest or South. Things are demographically much different in different parts of the country. Most of the very religious people I knew in the Philadelphia area were old-school Catholics or blacks. Not exactly the Republican Party base. Many of the more racist people I knew were hardcore Democrats, too. Lower-middle-class union hardhat types who were quite xenophobic. I know that is not the same experience as people in the Midwest and South. The only super-religious people I know in L.A. are either Mexican or my very observant Jewish bosses at my current job.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  10. #110
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    With religious wackos? Most people I know are not, but I know some very religious and socially conservative Catholics and Jews. Many of them are Democrats and not particularly big fans of free markets, actually. And, of course, I met a few conservatarian types at the Ron Paul rally and FFF conference (anti-bailout folks). The one group of people I found to be pretty consistently religious AND pro-free market were the Heritage Foundation donors I called when I was doing phone fundraising for nonprofits. A few random paleoconservative types or just complete weirdos (including one disgusting racist). The vast majority of these people were not going on any type of religious ranting. A couple of Birthers and "Obama's a crypto-fascist socialist communist!" types who were totally bummed around the inauguration. Are you trying to tell me that every social conservative you've ever met is pro-free market? I find that highly unlikely. Where do you live again?
    I really, really wish that my Religious Right relatives understood that most of the people they are voting for feel the same way about them that you do. I think their political views are hypocritical and misinformed, but overall, they are decent, well-meaning people. I hate seeing their sincerely held beliefs about the sanctity of life, etc exploited by people who think they are, for all intents and purposes, crazy idiots.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

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