User Tag List

Results 1 to 9 of 9

  1. #1
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    9 so/sx
    Posts
    21,686

    Default Pride in Ownership

    I was watching the film American Gangster, I appreciate this is removed from reality even if its based on true events, but at the beginning of it there's a dying gangster who bemoans the replacement of local and small with large and upscale, they go to a discount store and the guy says there is no such thing as pride in ownership or a personal service.

    This is something that interests me, its similar to the support of property chapter in Nisbet's book on Conservatism, in which he quotes a journalist or writer attacking a mine owner who had had strikers shot down, not because he'd shot them down but because he'd hesitated to shoot them down. The reason being that while life is fleeting that property and assets are not.

    In each instance I think what is being stated is at once morally abhorent but has also more than an element of truth. What's everyones opinion on that?

  2. #2
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    MBTI
    ENTJ
    Enneagram
    3w4
    Posts
    6,276

    Default

    You really think those two situations are equivalent? Care to explain your reasoning?
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  3. #3
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    9 so/sx
    Posts
    21,686

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    You really think those two situations are equivalent? Care to explain your reasoning?
    No I dont.

    Its a question about ownership, the first point was one in which it was implied that plenty lead to a lack of pride in ownership which as socially and individually deterious.

    The second was making essentially the same point, that pride in ownership should be so great that it would be paramount over life even. Sorry if it wasnt clear.

  4. #4
    Senior Member WoodsWoman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Posts
    884

    Default

    When ownership is divorced from personal accomplishment and delayed gratification it can become a god unto itself. Never a pretty sight.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    9 so/sx
    Posts
    21,686

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WoodsWoman View Post
    When ownership is divorced from personal accomplishment and delayed gratification it can become a god unto itself. Never a pretty sight.
    I agree with what you're saying but I also think that pride in ownership could be a substitute or sufficient to prevent the kind of squanderous behaviour there is if it existed like it has in the past.

    The easy come, easy go mindset bothers me, there's a lot of things available in the developed world, even to those entirely dependent upon others for their fiscal welfare or subsistence, which cost people a lot of create in the developing world in man hours and serious effort. The true costs arent reflected in the prices. Its a capitalist magic trick which benefits many of the people who are quickest to condemn it too.

  6. #6
    Senior Member WoodsWoman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Posts
    884

    Default

    Can you give an example of what this might look like? And define 'true cost' - I think I know what you mean but the term is ambiguous.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    9 so/sx
    Posts
    21,686

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WoodsWoman View Post
    Can you give an example of what this might look like? And define 'true cost' - I think I know what you mean but the term is ambiguous.
    Hmm, I dont think that price reflects the cost to the workers in production, dont know how to put it but at the same time I dont want to bemoan that people have things.

    Capitalism is great, its exactly how Marx said, it will max out production and ensure everyone has plenty but at a great personal cost to the producers some where along the line. Just because production is global now we dont hear about it so much anymore, the grafters are in countries were they have low expectations of personal returns anyway, like China.

    The squanderous mindset is easy to illustrate, things are disgarded because they arent fashionable not because they are worn out or beyond repair, most of the time now its cheaper to buy something new than have it repaired.

  8. #8
    Senior Member WoodsWoman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Posts
    884

    Default

    The squanderous mindset - it seems a shallow covering, an attempt to find something to "make" one feel better that is doomed to fail due to true happiness needing to come from within - something many refuse to face. It takes a lot of guts and work to deal with life - but if we can just purchase the right thing (thanks to advertising) we'll somehow have the perfect life and be perfectly happy.

    I hope I'm not going off on a tangent, am tired and not sure of my thought patterns at the moment.

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    9w8 sp/sx
    Posts
    1,636

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WoodsWoman View Post
    The squanderous mindset - it seems a shallow covering, an attempt to find something to "make" one feel better that is doomed to fail due to true happiness needing to come from within - something many refuse to face. It takes a lot of guts and work to deal with life - but if we can just purchase the right thing (thanks to advertising) we'll somehow have the perfect life and be perfectly happy.

    I hope I'm not going off on a tangent, am tired and not sure of my thought patterns at the moment.
    I thought that was a great post.

Similar Threads

  1. Extremes of humility and pride in a game
    By UnitOfPopulation in forum General Psychology
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: 07-23-2016, 03:24 PM
  2. Blue Eyed White Man Arrested in L.A. Near Gay Pride Parades
    By Thalassa in forum Politics, History, and Current Events
    Replies: 84
    Last Post: 06-22-2016, 01:32 AM
  3. Replies: 49
    Last Post: 07-19-2010, 01:30 PM
  4. Moving the furniture in. Making the place cozy.
    By Brendan in forum Welcomes and Introductions
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 05-14-2009, 02:52 AM
  5. pt Clocks in
    By ptgatsby in forum Welcomes and Introductions
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 04-26-2007, 04:11 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO