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  1. #91
    Senior Member ObliviousExistence's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post
    Can someone do something about the hostile derailer/heckler in this thread please? Report post apparently isn't working.
    Why are you talking about your self in the third person and why are you reporting your own posts?
    "He was free, free in every way, free to behave like a fool or a machine, free to accept, free to refuse, free to equivocate; to marry, to give up the game, to drag this death weight about with him for years to come. He could do what he liked, no one had the right to advise him, there would be for him no Good or Evil unless he thought them into being." JP Sartre

  2. #92
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post
    I'm sure you can read as well as I.
    An unweighted average of subindex scores is used to calculate the overall index.
    Okay, here's my quick view of the single indicators:

    Labour force participation; bogus due to a combination of inherent bias against homemakers and differing capacities between countries to live on a single income

    Wage equality for similar work; much more information needed, very important and extremely relevant to the issue.

    Estimated earned income; more information needed, important and relevant to the issue, so long as actual workers and job-seekers are being compared.

    Legislators, senior officials, and managers (female to male ratio); bogus due to inclusion of elected positions (for reasons outlined previously) and less relevant than other issues due to problematic nature of ratio comparisons and how it often relates to individual choice rather than equal opportunity

    Professional and technical workers (female to male ratio); legitimate, but less relevant than other indicators for reason outlined above.

    Literacy rate; legitimate, very important and extremely relevant.

    Educational enrollment (varied); legitimate, very important and extremely relevant

    Sex ratio at birth: legitimate, very important and extremely relevant as it relates to gender-selective abortion. Potentially problematic if some groups naturally birth more females than other groups (hell if I know).

    Healthy life expectancy (female to male ratio); legitimate and important (higher rates for males is a major red-flag), but extremely problematic measurement (for instance, Russian males are dying off at abnormally higher rates that Russian females, which will give misleading result as far as relative gender equality is concerned).

    Women in Parliament: (very) bogus comparison, for reasons already stated

    Women in ministerial positions; legitimate, important, and relevant indicator, so long as positions are due to ostensibly meritocratic appointment.

    Years with female head of state; cross-country comparisons problematic (different candidate selection and electoral criteria) but not as much at this level of political power as is the case with different national Parliaments. Legitimate indicator, but not as important as others due to problems with cross-country comparisons.
    Last edited by lowtech redneck; 03-30-2010 at 11:39 PM. Reason: forgot a word

  3. #93
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    Male embryos are more likely to spontaneously abort than female embryos, therefore making having a female baby ever-so-slightly more likely than having a male baby.

    Or so I've heard. I'm not sure how relevant that is, though.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  4. #94
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    We can even the gender gap in a very simple manner: the Nick Smith Method.

    "I've always planned to be a failure anyway. That's why I plan to marry an extremely wealthy woman."
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  5. #95
    Senior Member htb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    The study itself appears to be highly misleading and/or defective; one doesn't have to be a huge proponent of the United States to find something wrong with a study that links Pakistan in the same grouping as the United States in terms of gender equality.
    I'll take it one step further: any study equating North Korea with South Korea in terms of opportunity isn't worth the paper it's printed on.

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    We're often compared to Europe in these sorts of studies, but I don't think that comparison is really fair. The US has far more immigration from poor countries than any European country (perhaps more than all European countries combined? I'm not sure). Those people tend to be more traditional (wife stays at home with the kids, etc).

    My point being, I think the US is doing pretty well on this issue, contrary to the implications of the OP.
    Yeah, they also have health insurance and superior schools.

    The reason why they have more stay at home moms is that women can actually afford to stay at home!

    Do not blame this shit on the immigrants. Pleeeasssee. Let's put the blame where it rightfully belongs: on rich white men.

  7. #97
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    In most high-income liberal democracies, the party leadership effectively chooses who the Parliamentary candidates are, usually in multi-member districts, ensuring that voters vote for party platforms rather than individuals. In the United States, political candidates (who have independent capacity to raise campaign funds) have to defeat fellow party members in primaries, and then win a plurality of votes in single-member constituencies.

    In short, the political score is essentially an artificial indicator.
    This makes no sense. If a political system creates inequality for whatever reason, then it is indeed reflective of inequality in that nation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    We're often compared to Europe in these sorts of studies, but I don't think that comparison is really fair. The US has far more immigration from poor countries than any European country (perhaps more than all European countries combined? I'm not sure). Those people tend to be more traditional (wife stays at home with the kids, etc).

    My point being, I think the US is doing pretty well on this issue, contrary to the implications of the OP.
    New Zealand has a lot of immigrants (1 in 5 citizens were born outside New Zealand) and yet it was rated highly on equality. True, a number of migrants are Britons and South Africans (being mainly middle class) but we also have large numbers from poor, patriarchial nations such as Fiji, Samoa, India, Phillipines and Tonga. It is likely the percentage of poor migrants is a little higher in the US but I doubt it is a major factor as you say.

    I don't think America is really all that bad either, but then I've never been there (unless LAX counts as America ). I'd like to hear from someone who has actually lived and worked in both the US and another western nation and felt a noticeable difference in levels of sexism.

    And really, all nations need to be doing a better job at closing the inequality gap - there's no room for smug accusations. Lets face it, the ranking is listing countries from 'bad' to 'abysmal'. Pointing the finger at the US for having a 'dreadful' record while lauding other nations for being 'substandard' is a bit stupid.

  8. #98
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    This makes no sense. If a political system creates inequality for whatever reason, then it is indeed reflective of inequality in that nation.


    New Zealand has a lot of immigrants (1 in 5 citizens were born outside New Zealand) and yet it was rated highly on equality. True, a number of migrants are Britons and South Africans (being mainly middle class) but we also have large numbers from poor, patriarchial nations such as Fiji, Samoa, India, Phillipines and Tonga. It is likely the percentage of poor migrants is a little higher in the US but I doubt it is a major factor as you say.

    I don't think America is really all that bad either, but then I've never been there (unless LAX counts as America ). I'd like to hear from someone who has actually lived and worked in both the US and another western nation and felt a noticeable difference in levels of sexism.

    And really, all nations need to be doing a better job at closing the inequality gap - there's no room for smug accusations. Lets face it, the ranking is listing countries from 'bad' to 'abysmal'. Pointing the finger at the US for having a 'dreadful' record while lauding other nations for being 'substandard' is a bit stupid.

    In my travels, there seems to be less sexism in the U.S. than in Latin America, the UK, and Southern Europe. Continental Europe seemed pretty egalitarian in this regard. Of course, even generalizing for every region of the United States is difficult.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  9. #99
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    Population decline is going to ruin society. We need more young people or Social Security and Medicare are going to bankrupt us.
    Well, the alternative is the earth bankrputing us.
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

  10. #100
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    Yeah, they also have health insurance and superior schools.

    The reason why they have more stay at home moms is that women can actually afford to stay at home!

    Do not blame this shit on the immigrants. Pleeeasssee. Let's put the blame where it rightfully belongs: on rich white men.
    If I had known you were going to participate, I could have written this post for you. Your opinion of white males is well known on this forum.

    I don't know what "shit" you're talking about. The US is only about 0.01-0.02 behind most of Europe, and the US ranks AHEAD of most European countries on the economic part of the analysis. The US is also tied for first in education, according to the charts.

    I do believe the US would be higher on the economic list if it didn't have so many immigrants from poor countries. They bring a different culture with them, one that is less open to women fully participating in the work force. Many female immigrants have part time jobs as unskilled laborers, but it's uncommon for them to try to improve their standing. The males, on the other hand, don't have the same cultural limitations placed on them.

    As for your comment about rich white males having stay-at-home wives, it's not just white males who do this, and it's not just Americans, either.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

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