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  1. #191
    null Jonny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spin-1/2-nuclei View Post
    That being said if you want to make this about me then let me school you on what I've learned about death... My brother died in my arms and it was awful. Moreover, as I am also a pilot and worked as a pilot prior to entering graduate school I've seen plenty of death associated with this war... and have nearly died myself. I was more afraid when I lost my brother and my friends then I was when I almost died. There are things in this world that are worse than death.... I am not afraid to die... I am afraid of suffering while I am alive...

    I decided to dedicate my life to the scientific advancement of mankind - not by accident as you presume though you don't know me thus you pulled that right out of your ass... I believe it is only right to leave future generations with the same resources and environment that we inherited if not better... It is certainly wrong to condemn them to a life of suffering...

    It takes hard work and dedication to obtain the knowledge that I and others like me have.. Anyone could do this if they tried but many don't have the motivation to do so... I won't be schooled by self righteous know-it-alls with no personal experience yet all too willing to judge people they don't even know... What you are essentially expecting me to do is try to hold up the sun with my bare hands.. you're so ignorant of the facts you can't even see this. One person cannot solve global warming this problem is beyond one person as logic appears to be beyond you...
    I am not expecting anything of you. I am saying that you were lucky enough to have life experiences leading you to where you are (If you are as educated in the sciences as I believe you are, then you must believe that control and choice are really illusions). Yes, it is by virtue of luck that you are where you are today. You might wish to attribute it to hard work, but to be motivated to work hard one must be born with something (or have life experiences) which motivate him/her. You have had the luxury of wanting to go into science, and happening upon the understanding which you have.

    Edit: Whether you have a fear of death or suffering, you believe that both will occur should climate change not be dealt with. Both should be motivating factors.

    Edit2: I'm sorry if I've come across as hostile, my intentions are not to put anyone down, or to cause anyone pain.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  2. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    I was always under the impression that global warming was an issue if we're worried about dying. If that's no longer the problem, why do anything? Just sit back and watch the fireworks.
    There is no guarantee that global warming will result in death in your lifetime or that it wont.. If you worry about global warming then you either have children or grandchildren or you're not a selfish prick void of compassion for others.. seriously do you think every doctor has all of illnesses they treat... or every soldier feels personally threatened prior to every war they enter..

    Some people are motivated by whatever effects them - those people won't care about global warming until the oceans are fucking up their beaches or worse destroying their home. Other people just don't think it's right to go around fucking everything up for other people - even if they aren't born yet - just because it might not effect you... it all comes down to what kind of person you are..

    the facts of global warming however are independent of any of this shit.. what will happen will happen regardless of what we think of it or what our motives are when dealing with it.
    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    watch where you're driving f$cktards! I have the right of way!!! :steam:

  3. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonnyboy View Post
    I am not expecting anything of you. I am saying that you were lucky enough to have life experiences leading you to where you are (If you are as educated in the sciences as I believe you are, then you must believe that control and choice are really illusions). Yes, it is by virtue of luck that you are where you are today. You might wish to attribute it to hard work, but to be motivated to work hard one must be born with something (or have life experiences) which motivate him/her. You have had the luxury of wanting to go into science, and happening upon the understanding which you have.
    Well I can't change your world view but I don't share it. Still global warming is what it is even if people have trouble believing in it.. Scientists don't get the benefit of blind faith that religions get.. People won't just trust us because we say so like they do god... Moreover the canyons that need to be crossed in order to facilitate understanding are wide... how people can expect to understand something after a few months of google searching when it takes leading researchers decades is beyond me... If people can't trust that those who bring them computers, and medicine, and cars, and space travel are telling them the facts of the situation then we are left with trying to help them understand through the data, but some think they have expertise that really isn't there thus they reach the wrong conclusions or they simply chose to disregard what we say because the issue is complex and exact dates, times, and values cannot be provided... This is the plight of the scientist trying to educate people on global warming... It really is like trying to teach chaos theory to someone who has never studied basic algebra.. the gap is so large where do you even begin?

    Edit: in response to your edit I am sufficiently motivated to solve the problem of global warming, but as I said before.. I can't solve this problem alone... I would need to have some sort of groundbreaking discovery the likes of which would win me the nobel prize in physics, chemistry, and Biology.... this I'm not even sure Einstein could do... so you can imagine what my odds are. I'm just one person.. one scientist.. collectively it might be possible for us to make these kinds of breakthroughs but we need funding and we wont get that if people don't vote appropriately.... So the problem isn't with my motivation or the motivation of scientists collectively but more with the social and political problems at hand.. we strive to prevent and reverse manmade environmental damage but we can't make the politicians install the technology, we can't make the economy take a back seat to our scientific developments... that kind of stuff has to come from the voting public... Science PhDs make up a really small percentage of the US population so our voting barely even impacts this...
    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    watch where you're driving f$cktards! I have the right of way!!! :steam:

  4. #194
    Member Desert's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spin-1/2-nuclei View Post
    Knowledge about numbers and science is all that is required to solve the problem of global warming etc... Since I don't spend my days trying to pass of ignorance for knowledge I don't have to worry if my arguments are presented nicely only that they are presented accurately... and they always are because I don't talk about things I don't understand. It's not my job to connect the dots for you... go get a formal education as I did. Understanding complex issues takes time. It really is that simple...
    My are you really such an intellectual dodo. I know more than enough about the arguments for and against global warming. But it seems to me that snobs like you seem to for get that you do not convince people of anything if you attack their person. Because your narrow mindedness seems to forget that in order to bring about the change you so desperately want to see you first need to know how to communicate it properly. That is why I stated that my money was on Antisocial one because he/she actually took the time to explain to someone perceived as not knowing and could actually communicate better. Fact and figures don't mean squat if you can't get it across in the right way.

  5. #195
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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  6. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    Fortunately the rest of the scientific community does not agree with them.. Thankfully we require some sort of majority consensus in science prior to supporting wild claims made by rogue researchers....

    It's amazing what people will support even today with all of our access to information... Your link reminds me of this...

    "In 1956, Samuel Shenton, a Fellow of the Royal Astronomical Society and the Royal Geographic Society took over the Universal Zetetic Society and helped to found the International Flat Earth Society, which he ran, as "organizing secretary" from his home in Dover, in Britain.[13] When satellite images taken from outer space showed the Earth as a sphere rather than flat the society was undaunted; Shenton remarked: "It's easy to see how a photograph like that could fool the untrained eye."[14]" - Flat Earth Society - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


    Edit: for more reading on why cosmic rays are not causing global warming you can read the following links...

    - :: SCRIPPS OCEANOGRAPHY NEWS : : Cosmic Rays are Not the Cause of Climate Change, Scientists Say ::
    - No Link Between Cosmic Rays and Global Warming | Wired Science | Wired.com <------- this one is a really quick read
    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    watch where you're driving f$cktards! I have the right of way!!! :steam:

  7. #197
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spin-1/2-nuclei View Post
    I don't need to read it personally since I am well aware of this research, but perhaps you should read this as the sun hypothesis has already been discredited - Changes In The Sun Are Not Causing Global Warming, New Study Shows
    Carnegie Mellon University's Peter Adams along with Jeff Pierce from Dalhousie University in Halifax, Canada, have developed a model to test a controversial hypothesis that says changes in the sun are causing global warming.
    There is only one way to prove or disprove their hypothesis, and that is to create a duplicate Earth (a real planet, not a model subject to the assumptions of the scientist) to use as a scientific control. Any other method is inherently flawed. To claim that you can use a model to make discoveries is...well...retarded. Models are the product of research, research is not the product of models.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  8. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    There is only one way to prove or disprove their hypothesis, and that is to create a duplicate Earth (a real planet, not a model subject to the assumptions of the scientist) to use as a scientific control. Any other method is inherently flawed. To claim that you can use a model to make discoveries is...well...retarded. Models are the product of research, research is not the product of models.
    LOL!
    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    watch where you're driving f$cktards! I have the right of way!!! :steam:

  9. #199
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    Why would we work to prevent it, though? It's not like this is the first time the Earth's climate has never changed, and it certainly won't be the last. Nobody cared enough to try to prevent it those last times, so why now? Just because we caused it? Who says other organisms haven't caused climate change before? We don't know. Because it's happening particularly fast? Why is that such a problem?

    We are apparently rational creatures, we don't need to fear death. Are we worried about the other animals on the earth? Why? Mere sentimentality, species have gone extinct due to climate change before. Do we fear for our children? Simple, then -- don't have any children, and then there is nothing to fear.

    When you take fear of death out of the equation, any reason to prevent climate change turns into mere philosophy.
    Empathy. It's sort of an important part of being human.

  10. #200
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spin-1/2-nuclei View Post
    LOL!
    It's too bad that this branch of science has become so politicized. Discussions of physics rarely evoke reactions like this. Though, I suppose some people could find it funny that climate science is so complex that some scientists have abandoned the scientific method.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

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