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  1. #71
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    The US has far too much intellectual capital to become a third world country any time in the foreseeable future.
    How do you convert currency into intellectual capital, and then that back into currency again, without state intervention like IP law?

    That's the conundrum the US has right now - in an anarchical (i.e. free trade) market, intellectual capital, due to its inherent infinite reproducibility and non-exclusability, has a near-zero value. It's only when you force others to respect patents, trademarks and copyrights that you can impose a value of sorts upon them.

    The Chinese, among others, have no interest in respecting Western intellectual property law, and in reality, why should they?

  2. #72
    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    How do you convert currency into intellectual capital, and then that back into currency again, without state intervention like IP law?

    That's the conundrum the US has right now - in an anarchical (i.e. free trade) market, intellectual capital, due to its inherent infinite reproducibility and non-exclusability, has a near-zero value. It's only when you force others to respect patents, trademarks and copyrights that you can impose a value of sorts upon them.

    The Chinese, among others, have no interest in respecting Western intellectual property law, and in reality, why should they?
    This is a damn good point.

    Microsoft is a great example. Pirated versions of their applications abound throughout the world, but in the U.S., they rake it in hand over fist. In Europe they do too, but the courts over there have busted their chops a few times.

    Pharmaceutical companies, another great example. Drugs here in teh U.S. sell for astronomical prices as compared to the exact same drugs made the same manufacturer but sold in Canada, just across the border.

    Even the RIAA has had some efficacy in busting users of P2P networks, whether it was an adult, 13 year old kid sharing the latest Taylor Swift album, or an unsuspecting grandparent whose grandkids were sharing files off of Grannies PC.

    Why? The U.S. enforces these corporations intellectual propery rights because these industries have contributed handsomely to campaign funds for many, many years. None of these industries has shit to say in Russia, China, India, or other major areas of the world.
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  3. #73
    Administrator highlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    How do you convert currency into intellectual capital, and then that back into currency again, without state intervention like IP law?

    That's the conundrum the US has right now - in an anarchical (i.e. free trade) market, intellectual capital, due to its inherent infinite reproducibility and non-exclusability, has a near-zero value. It's only when you force others to respect patents, trademarks and copyrights that you can impose a value of sorts upon them.

    The Chinese, among others, have no interest in respecting Western intellectual property law, and in reality, why should they?
    This seems to be a very central issue. It has been said that knowledge is power. However, the proliferation of information of all types, outsourcing, rampant theft of intellectual property, and lack of enforceable IP laws diminishes the advantage of all of that intellectual capital, which directly ties to revenue. It is why I think protection of intellectual property will be a very key issue over the coming years. There is currently a lot of focus on breaches of personal information. I think this may shift over the coming years as companies realize the true value of their data.

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  4. #74
    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by highlander29 View Post
    This seems to be a very central issue. It has been said that knowledge is power. However, the proliferation of information of all types, outsourcing, rampant theft of intellectual property, and lack of enforceable IP laws diminishes the advantage of all of that intellectual capital, which directly ties to revenue. It is why I think protection of intellectual property will be a very key issue over the coming years. There is currently a lot of focus on breaches of personal information. I think this may shift over the coming years as companies realize the true value of their data.
    I'm all for fair and reasonable enforcement of intellectual property rights, and for the protection of personal information.

    BUT - I am vehemently against abuse of intellectual property laws as Lateralus has pointed out before, such as Monsanto, Corp. sueing farmers that have corn which happens to test positive for "Monsanto corn DNA", which comes as a huge surprise to the farmer; as well as their aggressive stance on "Monsanto pig DNA." That type of abuse of patents/intellectual property law should not be tolerated in any capacity.
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  5. #75
    Administrator highlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halla74 View Post
    I'm all for fair and reasonable enforcement of intellectual property rights, and for the protection of personal information.

    BUT - I am vehemently against abuse of intellectual property laws as Lateralus has pointed out before, such as Monsanto, Corp. sueing farmers that have corn which happens to test positive for "Monsanto corn DNA", which comes as a huge surprise to the farmer; as well as their aggressive stance on "Monsanto pig DNA." That type of abuse of patents/intellectual property law should not be tolerated in any capacity.
    Good point. The system gone amok? Actually, this whole thing with genetically engineered seed to be resistant to Round-Up seems horribly perverted to me. I do not know how it can possibly be good or healthy.

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  6. #76
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by highlander29 View Post
    Good point. The system gone amok? Actually, this whole thing with genetically engineered seed to be resistant to Round-Up seems horribly perverted to me. I do not know how it can possibly be good or healthy.
    Meh, chemicals is chemicals, no matter if they're developed from within the plant's genetic code, or applied externally. They're not good for you in the long run, but then again, in the long run, we're all dead.

  7. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by highlander29 View Post
    I read earlier today that Americans are an optimistic and resilient bunch. We believe that economically we'll be better off in the future. What do you think?

    - The future role of the US in the world economy

    - Value of the dollar

    - Distance between haves and have nots

    - Globalization of the workforce

    - The service economy

    - The deficit

    What do you think it will be like in 5 years, 10 years, 20 years? How will US citizens be impacted?
    A lot of interesting stuff on the coming (well, it's here, actually, sort of) economic collapse of the U.S. at LewRockwell.com .

  8. #78
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    How do you convert currency into intellectual capital, and then that back into currency again, without state intervention like IP law?

    That's the conundrum the US has right now - in an anarchical (i.e. free trade) market, intellectual capital, due to its inherent infinite reproducibility and non-exclusability, has a near-zero value. It's only when you force others to respect patents, trademarks and copyrights that you can impose a value of sorts upon them.

    The Chinese, among others, have no interest in respecting Western intellectual property law, and in reality, why should they?
    You're using the term intellectual capital too strictly. I'm not talking about intellectual property. The term simply means, the US has a highly educated society (more comparable to Europe than Africa or large parts of Asia). That is valuable, too valuable for the US to deteriorate into a third world country.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  9. #79
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    You're using the term intellectual capital too strictly. I'm not talking about intellectual property. The term simply means, the US has a highly educated society (more comparable to Europe than Africa or large parts of Asia). That is valuable, too valuable for the US to deteriorate into a third world country.
    OK. What happens when there aren't all that many necessary jobs for those high education levels?

  10. #80
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    OK. What happens when there aren't all that many necessary jobs for those high education levels?
    Lots of different things, one of those being that people will go into business for themselves.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

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