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  1. #71
    Sniffles
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    I need to find it, but there was an interesting article I read awhile ago comparing the natures of American and French Catholicism. Not surprisingly I seem to fit the French mold better.

  2. #72
    Sniffles
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    Quote Originally Posted by evilrobot View Post
    Obviously the Korans meaning depends on its interpretation, but theres no doubt about fascist smilarities between the Nazis and radical Islam. For instance, theyve used Nazi anti-Semite propoganda films in classrooms in some Islamic countries.
    The whole Islamo-Fascist meme has been done to death really, especially with its explosion after 9/11. Although some parallels can be drawn between the two, you have to keep in mind that Islamism and fascism draw upon different political-cultural traditions: namely Western(post-1789) vs Islamic. The two traditions operate on different sets of assumptionms.

  3. #73
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    I know that's totally out of context, but in Germany regarding war crimes, nowadays you have to play it still really low as low as possible.

    That bears no reasonable foundation at all, cause I was born in 1983 and what could I had changed about the past.

    Then again I doubt humans to be reasonable. I most probably wouldnt be either
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  4. #74
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    Are you aware that concerning your own biases, It's the USA vs the rest of the Western World.
    I majored in IR/comparative...I am well aware of that. I'm not particularly impressed.

    Dude, you asked me an opinion question, and I gave you what I consider to be a reasonably nuanced and humble answer; I said that I think the United States has superior overall democratic institutions on the basis of my principles, and I acknowledged that my principles are subjective, so there is no need to be offended simply because you have differing principles to my own. Are European diplomats "arrogant" or "condescending" when they invite us to join the ICC or to abolish the death penalty, or are they simply (like I said) attempting to advocate change at the margins of allied nations in order to advance the principles their countries choose to represent?

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    In the realm of free speech and free religion, yes; I think the laws in place in most European countries substantially decrease the overall level of personal freedom and public debate.

    That said, there are other elements involved in a state's overall level of (liberal) democracy, and its possible for a country to be deficient relative to some countries in major democratic indicators yet exceed those countries in overall democratization. For instance, before the Voting Rights Act, post-WWII France was probably more democratic than the United States due to the lack of protection of black voting rights in my country.

    Also, while I DO frankly view the United States as slightly more "democratic" than European countries (with the possible exception of Switzerland) in modern times, that is influenced by my bias toward local control, the accountability of representatives to constituents rather than party leaders, limited government, and extensive checks and balances (allow me to take this moment to thank your country for Montesquieu...and, um, for the fact that my country exists at all). To many people, those last two elements in particular are indicative of an overall lack of procedural democracy, and they may therefore conclude that the United States is less "democratic" than most of Europe, while for me those institutional aspects are crucial to the "liberal" element of a liberal democracy.

    In short, I (subjectively) think the United States is more "democratic" than France, but not simply because of First Amendment protections; I have several other biases which essentially favor the United States by default. However, I view France and the rest of Western Europe as overall exemplars of democracy by any practical or comparative standard. My intentions are not to insult Europe, but to encourage change at the margins within countries that I consider natural allies toward the global advancement of liberal democracy and human rights.
    I am pro-freedom, NOT pro-"democracy" per se...

    Democracy is frequently the enemy of freedom...

  6. #76
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Why always Europe/USA debates come down to Western Europe/USA debates ?

    To be honest I think that usually things turns into this because of US side in the "debate".
    I mean it looks to me that Americans still didn't fully chew up a fact that the Iron curtain does not exist anymore.


    I am I correct ?

  7. #77

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    On the surface it seems like his human rights are being violated.

    mistakes of the past should be learnt from but not used as an excuse to suppress debate.

    until i know more this is all i have to say.

  8. #78
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by evilrobot View Post
    True. They have to nip it in the bud and should have already done so by now. The Europeans' general cowed reaction to Islamic fundamentalist fury over the political cartoons a few years ago is probably a good example of what you mean by pussified.

    *

    Obviously the Korans meaning depends on its interpretation, but theres no doubt about fascist smilarities between the Nazis and radical Islam. For instance, theyve used Nazi anti-Semite propoganda films in classrooms in some Islamic countries. The usual questions of censorship boil down to: who decides and where do you draw the line?
    Yeah, using Nazi anti-Semite propaganda films proves that Nazi's and radical muslims are both anti-Semite, it does not prove they are both fascist. Horrible example.
    “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I’m here to tell you that fast is better. I’ve always believed this, in spite of the trouble it’s caused me. Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba…”


  9. #79
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fecal McAngry View Post
    I am pro-freedom, NOT pro-"democracy" per se...

    Democracy is frequently the enemy of freedom...
    Are you an advocate of any more Vague Nouns, like Righteousness or Liberty? Does pro-freedom mean that you want murder everyone without consequence? Or does it mean you want the right to vote in elections? Local or Federal?
    “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I’m here to tell you that fast is better. I’ve always believed this, in spite of the trouble it’s caused me. Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba…”


  10. #80
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Why always Europe/USA debates come down to Western Europe/USA debates ?

    To be honest I think that usually things turns into this because of US side in the "debate".
    I mean it looks to me that Americans still didn't fully chew up a fact that the Iron curtain does not exist anymore.


    I am I correct ?
    Not really. I think it's more because Americans feel closest kin to England, France, and Germany in Europe. Notice that we rarely discuss Spain or Portugal in these things, too, and only sometimes Scandinavia.

    Also, it probably has something to do with Americans not knowing the names of the countries east of Poland.

    Or maybe you're right about the iron curtain thing. I mean, I remember maps at school still having the U.S.S.R. marked as late as my second grade year -- that was 1998! And I went to one of the wealthier school districts, too!
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

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