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  1. #21
    Senior Member Lightyear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueSprout View Post
    I think that it would be ignorant to assume that impoverished groups in the third world would actively hope for a disaster to obtain relief. They become displaced, suffer the loss of family members, and lose their shelter and possessions (however meager they might seem). Just because most situations in the third world might look the same to you at any time doesn't mean that this is how the people who live there experience them. This past day was not in any way "normal" for the people who were directly affected.
    Exactly. 100,000 dead in a population of 9 million is not business as usual. It's like discussing if you should help your chain-smoking brother directly after he got injured in a car crash, why should you bother saving him now when you have never tried to get him off cigarettes which are killing him slowly? Of course you would help him anyway, the past doesn't matter, he desperatly needs medical attention now.

  2. #22
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    It is a remarkable geographical and social event, I think we can all agree on that.

    Also, apparently this happened because Haiti swore a pact to the Devil in order to get free from the French, and is cursed now.

    Or this is just what Pat Robertson thinks.
    Pat Robertson: Haiti 'Cursed' By 'Pact To The Devil' (VIDEO)

  3. #23
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lightyear View Post
    Exactly. 100,000 dead in a population of 9 million is not business as usual. It's like discussing if you should help your chain-smoking brother directly after he got injured in a car crash, why should you bother saving him now when you have never tried to get him off cigarettes which are killing him slowly? Of course you would help him anyway, the past doesn't matter, he desperatly needs medical attention now.

    Well I am aware of the fact that my work in my thread makes me look like an ass. I am simply saying that someone will profit out of this, What should not be the case.

    Especially since that is probably the same "influential force" that made them poor in the first place. On the other hand just look at Haiti's neighbours Cuba , Dominican republic , Jamaica, and same tiny island states. Basicly all of them could usde a aid like this. Basicly throught out a few years 100 000 certainly died from unatural causes of death because of poverty in that part of the world. But no one really cared because there was no spectacle.
    However this way people FEEL the need to help.


    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    Yeah, I do agree with this part of what you and ASO are saying.

    Though I'm a bit disturbed at people saying that they wouldn't feel as bad if it happened in California. What the fuck? Human beings live there too, and they all aren't millionaire movie stars.

    Of course the devastation in Haiti is worse, though, because of the poverty there.

    P.S. There are geological faultlines all over the place. One runs right through Nevada (when I lived in Vegas people told me "when the big one hits and California goes, we go too"), and there's actually one that runs under West Virginia of all places (my sister is a science geek and found this out). While earthquakes aren't as common there, they're still possible. There's really few places to live on earth that are completely shielded from the possibility of natural disaster.

    Yes but this is not ordinary place. This is the border between two plates. (same case is with California and Japan)

    Basicly this is like puting an egg into a boiling water and then having a panic attack because of the fact that it got cooked. There is no difference. Scientists decades ago knew that this is going to happen one day since it was inevitable. That is why I am not getting emotional about this.

  4. #24
    movin melodies kiddykat's Avatar
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    Even if they did want to relocate, where would they have found the financial backing to do so?

    It's like blaming the victims of Katrina for not leaving soon enough. Some people don't have the resources to do so (might I add- Haiti is among one of the poorest nations in the world). It was an unfortunate situation.

  5. #25
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Well I am aware of the fact that my work in my thread makes me look like an ass. I am simply saying that someone will profit out of this, What should not be the case.
    I don't think you look like an ass, and I understand your point. But my point is so what if people knew it was going to happen, it's still a sad state of affairs. We can't help where we're born. You are from a war torn country and I felt bad for you guys all through that war, whether it was "deserved" or not.

    And you're right, nobody cares about anyone all the time. As soon as your war was over, you were forgotten in the minds of everyone - same like Haiti is and will always be. But that doesn't make it wrong to care in the first place. If all this news drums out a few hundred people who will continue on a path of altruism, then it's all worth it, right? Seriously, people go in to Doctors Without Borders or Engineers Without Borders simply because of news like this. And that has a lasting effect.

    To see children being pulled out of the rubble and knowing that saving them could actually be worse for them is just sad. And that's the point.

  6. #26
    Geolectric teslashock's Avatar
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    Hey there was just another thread about small quakes going on in California, potentially pointing to the impending doom of a larger and more catastrophic quake. Can a quake in Haiti be associated with plate movements in California? I'm basically a complete doof when it comes to geology (unfortunately); I know which pieces of my dinnerware are microwave safe and which aren't but that's about the extent of my knowledge in regards to plate science. Anyway, is it possible that the two are related?

    I feel like the world is ending (not really, but it's fun to think about), but that may just be due to my mildly sadistic intrigue with apocalyptic scenarios.

  7. #27
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teslashock View Post
    I feel like the world is ending (not really, but it's fun to think about), but that may just be due to my mildly sadistic intrigue with apocalyptic scenarios.
    Are you talking about something like 2012?
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  8. #28
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teslashock View Post

    I feel like the world is ending (not really, but it's fun to think about), but that may just be due to my mildly sadistic intrigue with apocalyptic scenarios.
    Glad I'm not the only one.



  9. #29
    No Cigar Litvyak's Avatar
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    [sorry, edited]

    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    1. They are living on the border of two tectonic plates. Where the potential for very stong earthquakes is the strongest.
    2. It was also known that most buildings over there can't sustain this kind of a earthquake.
    3. It is well know for decades that they are very poor country in every way. I mean no one was really that much interested in helping them before this.
    So? Does this change the international consequences of the event? Its newsworthiness? The responsibilites of governments and NGOs worldwide?

    Quote Originally Posted by JocktheMotie View Post
    He is saying that it's a relatively unremarkable geological event made memorable by the fact that some people happen to live there.
    Eh? So how come that the excitement is "not understandable"? It's totally understandable because it has happened in a country where millions are living. It has an economical and political importance. What's the point of the comment?

    Quote Originally Posted by ceecee View Post
    I choose to live here but I didn't know this could happen!
    I'm sure people born and raised on the streets have great opportunities in changing their residence and other conditions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    I think all of this is hypocritical. They needed help long before this happened and now everybody are so sorry for them. While in a about the month from now most people will not remember that this even happened.
    There are countries poorer than Haiti, they deserve every penny of support and fundings. I'm not sure if I chose the latter if I had a chance to choose between donating for Somalia or Haiti.

    The effects of the earthquake were disastrous, and now they're in a worse state than other developing countries. Plus, the mass media bites on these things, I don't see the hipocricy in it. If millions of people die from malaria every year, that's something "unusual", a sad yet constant position. If millions die because of an earthquake, that's something swift and sudden, so it's more newsworthy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    However this way people FEEL the need to help.
    ^ And that's exactly why it isn't hypocricy. They don't help because they want to feel their importance, but because they're inspired by a just cause. The fact that a sudden catastrophy has more motivational power than other processes can be derived by human nature.

    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Basicly this is like puting an egg into a boiling water and then having a panic attack because of the fact that it got cooked. There is no difference. Scientists decades ago knew that this is going to happen one day since it was inevitable. That is why I am not getting emotional about this.
    O_o

    Are we blaming the people who colonized Haiti despite of these dangers they didn't know about, or the people who couldn't leave it because of their insane poverty, or the people who could leave but didn't want to, because it's their homeland despite the fact that there is a higher chance of an earthquake happening? Or the people who're still shocked by the terrible news despite that most upper-middle class intellectuals knew about the elevated risks, which means that this could've or couldn't have happened sometimes in the future?

    And where's the connection between being 'emotional' about a humanitarian disaster and a mistake some people somewhere presumably made?

    I don't like your example. It's like an old stray dog nobody really cared about being led/forced in the abyss, and people who see the whole thing suddenly feeling empathy and wanting to help.

  10. #30
    Geolectric teslashock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    Are you talking about something like 2012?
    Yeah dude that'd be epic. I keep an armory of ESTPs at my disposal, just in case...

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