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  1. #61
    Senior Member ubiquitous1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    I think there's a legal doctrine that helps explain the seeming gap in logic - "inherently dangerous products and activities". While cars have many dangers associated with them, few people would argue that the dangers are inherent to the nature of it being a car (while its transportation value is). Meanwhile, the danger associated with a gun (bullets kill things) is inherent in the purpose a gun is designed for (to forcefully lodge bullets into things).
    So, are people who support gun control more concerned with the intent of guns or the number of people who are killed by guns?

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by ubiquitous1 View Post
    So, are people who support gun control more concerned with the intent of guns or the number of people who are killed by guns?
    I'm more into numbers, seriously. I know people are fucked up. I have no illusions. I just don't see why we should make it more accessable to fucked up people to take out an entire group of people, when with another weapon they might only get to one or two.

    Mostly, I despise the ability to randomly attack innocent people in public settings. Hand guns make this all too convenient.

    I'm not entirely against guns. I am opposed to the easy access of certain types of guns.

  3. #63
    Senior Member ubiquitous1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Yes... a gun is a tool. It is a tool designed to do a better job at killing than anything that existed before the gun. This is the basis of the concern.
    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    A concept of inherent badness has never been a part of my argument.
    Sorry, I inferred from statement #1 that you thought guns were inherently bad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    As has already been said, cars are also involved in far more utility than guns.
    That is opinion. I am sure hunters and people who use guns in self-defense would disagree.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Why do you think the USA has such a high rate of deaths by gun, but almost no one being killed with explosives?
    Define high and how many of these shootings were justified? And if we were to implement gun control here I bet these people who go on shooting rampages would turn to bombings and kill even more people. Bombings like the one in Oklahoma City in 1995 would become much more common.People who are intent on mass killings will find a way to kill. Additionally, I think gun related deaths is the 7th leading cause of death in the US, far behind automobile fatalities.

  4. #64
    Senior Member ubiquitous1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    I'm more into numbers, seriously. I know people are fucked up. I have no illusions. I just don't see why we should make it more accessable to fucked up people to take out an entire group of people, when with another weapon they might only get to one or two.

    Mostly, I despise the ability to randomly attack innocent people in public settings. Hand guns make this all too convenient.

    I'm not entirely against guns. I am opposed to the easy access of certain types of guns.
    If it were that easy to prevent fucked up people from doing fucked up things then I would support it. However, I don't think it would be that easy. Case in point: NY Mom's Wrong-Way Crash Kills 8; 4 Kids - CBS News Such a heart breaking story.Maybe we should ban drugs and drunk driving too.

  5. #65
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ubiquitous1 View Post
    That is opinion. I am sure hunters and people who use guns in self-defense would disagree.
    I am not intersted in beginning a case-study just for this thread, but I feel confident that one could rather objectively show that cars serve a greater purpose. A statement beyond opinion. But like I said, I'm just not interested in investing that much.


    Quote Originally Posted by ubiquitous1 View Post
    Define high
    For the point I'm getting at, I don't need to be very specific. Let us simply define high as higher, by ratio, than the rest of the developed world.

    Quote Originally Posted by ubiquitous1 View Post
    and how many of these shootings were justified?
    How many bombings in Afghanistan are justified? Do you really want me to try answering that?

    Whatever you want, I won't, because answer I find the question unattenable.

    Quote Originally Posted by ubiquitous1 View Post
    And if we were to implement gun control here I bet these people who go on shooting rampages would turn to bombings and kill even more people. Bombings like the one in Oklahoma City in 1995 would become much more common.People who are intent on mass killings will find a way to kill. Additionally, I think gun related deaths is the 7th leading cause of death in the US, far behind automobile fatalities.
    I'm well, well aware that automobiles kill more people. I've already said that the comparative cost of banning automobiles as opposed to guns is however even greater in contrast. Much, much, greater.

    The question, I think, requires me to ask about common place killings, as opposed to the odd mass killer. Do you think the random bursts of gun violence (which kill far more people than meditated killing sprees) would be replaced with random bombings if guns were banned?
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  6. #66
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ubiquitous1 View Post
    So, are people who support gun control more concerned with the intent of guns or the number of people who are killed by guns?
    The intent. Numbers are just a way to quantify a very abstract problem, that is, it is impossible to separate the proper use of a gun from its biggest danger. It is impossible to use a gun with reasonable care and eliminate the danger of harming others.

    Personally, I don't think heavy gun control is all that necessary, but I see their point. That's why I think blanket standards are fairly counterproductive - cities should be able to have one set of gun laws while rural areas have another.

  7. #67
    Member Chuckums's Avatar
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    We use this as an example of "Don't Let This Happen Here!"

    This is no joke. It is documented WWII history your teachers do not teach you. Americans sent tens of thousands of these personally owned firearms to England with the understanding they would be returned after the cessation of hostilities.

    Most of these guns, many of them family heirlooms and important historical artifacts, were dumped in the Atlantic by the "authorities" after the war.

    When all those guns got passed out to your families, did you all start blowing each other away, or were you able to control yourselves?

  8. #68
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charles Isaac View Post


    We use this as an example of "Don't Let This Happen Here!"

    This is no joke. It is documented WWII history your teachers do not teach you. Americans sent tens of thousands of these personally owned firearms to England with the understanding they would be returned after the cessation of hostilities.

    Most of these guns, many of them family heirlooms and important historical artifacts, were dumped in the Atlantic by the "authorities" after the war.

    When all those guns got passed out to your families, did you all start blowing each other away, or were you able to control yourselves?
    You know there was a war on right?

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    You know there was a war on right?
    Does one's degree of self-control change because there's a war on?

  10. #70
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Does one's degree of self-control change because there's a war on?
    Well, you usually don't kill other people during peacetime.

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