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  1. #41
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    I read the OP and just responded to this without reading everything else yet, so forgive me if this has already been covered...

    As someone with a self-imposed limited diet, I am tired of always having to defend myself. I am a vegetarian and mostly vegan. My reasons for not eating meat were just because it grossed me out as a kid and I am a picky eater. Now, my health issues have made me cut more things out.

    At a restaurant, if someone asks for a dish with no brussel sprouts, no one blinks an eye. If I ask for a dish made without chicken stock, suddenly I am forced to defend myself against a wide gamut of political beliefs that have been assigned to me. I care not for the animal's lives, I could give a shit about the hormones pumped into meat. I simply don't eat what I don't like. I've never preached a word of my "beliefs" to anyone but yet I am combated constantly. People assign arguments to me and force me to argue them. It's fucking annoying.

    Why does anyone give a damn what anyone else eats? Just eat your own food and mind your own damn business. The militancy goes both ways and it's annoying, on both sides.

    Ok, I'll read the rest of the thread now. /rant

    EDIT: Sorry - didn't offer any advice... I simply tell people to live their lives in whatever way will make them happy and allow me to do the same. Basically, that's my polite way of saying FOAD before I actually am forced to utter those words. Simple.

  2. #42
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    People can get beat over the head with things on both sides.

    As long as people understand that, things usually work themselves out.
    The non-dominant side doesn't have the power to enforce their view without the approval of the dominant side. It's less the opinion than the power dynamics.

    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    You don't need to pretend that the other viewpoint is valid to you, either.
    Unless you find that viewpoint to be ultimately harmful to the greater society, what's the problem in doing so?

  3. #43
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    I'm of the opinion that we get closer to the truth when ideas are challenged. I don't have any desire or need to be around closed minded people. I do not refrain from respectfully questioning any view that is presented to me. Those who can't take it simply do not associate with me, so the problem will take care of itself.

  4. #44
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proximo View Post
    If the other viewpoint is valid to you, are you allowed to say so? Or is it useless, because whether it is or not, you're part of the majority and therefore not capable of any good or sincere thoughts or actions?
    Unless you're too weak-willed to come out against the majority, you can always go your own way socially.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  5. #45
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    The non-dominant side doesn't have the power to enforce their view without the approval of the dominant side. It's less the opinion than the power dynamics.
    The non-dominant side's opinion may be non-dominant for a reason, though. It may be silly or misguided.


    Unless you find that viewpoint to be ultimately harmful to the greater society, what's the problem in doing so?
    It's false earnestness for one. It encourages less debate for another. Mainly, the reason would be that there aren't different rules for the majority and the minority, so the same question could be asked in reverse: "you minority folks, why can't you at least PRETEND to fit in with the group here? Why not keep your dissent to yourselves?" Don't you see why that would be harmful? It doesn't matter if 99% of others agree or 0% of other agree. You have to let people voice their opinions. You DON'T have to make people value the opinions of others.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  6. #46
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    I read the OP and just responded to this without reading everything else yet, so forgive me if this has already been covered...

    As someone with a self-imposed limited diet, I am tired of always having to defend myself. I am a vegetarian and mostly vegan. My reasons for not eating meat were just because it grossed me out as a kid and I am a picky eater. Now, my health issues have made me cut more things out.

    At a restaurant, if someone asks for a dish with no brussel sprouts, no one blinks an eye. If I ask for a dish made without chicken stock, suddenly I am forced to defend myself against a wide gamut of political beliefs that have been assigned to me. I care not for the animal's lives, I could give a shit about the hormones pumped into meat. I simply don't eat what I don't like. I've never preached a word of my "beliefs" to anyone but yet I am combated constantly. People assign arguments to me and force me to argue them. It's fucking annoying.

    Why does anyone give a damn what anyone else eats? Just eat your own food and mind your own damn business. The militancy goes both ways and it's annoying, on both sides.

    Ok, I'll read the rest of the thread now. /rant

    EDIT: Sorry - didn't offer any advice... I simply tell people to live their lives in whatever way will make them happy and allow me to do the same. Basically, that's my polite way of saying FOAD before I actually am forced to utter those words. Simple.
    As long as you don't make barfing sounds while I eat a steak like my vegan ex- MIL did...I'm fine.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  7. #47
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ceecee View Post
    As long as you don't make barfing sounds while I eat a steak like my vegan ex- MIL did...I'm fine.
    That's just rude.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  8. #48
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    That's just rude.
    It is very rude. If meat offends someone that badly, they shouldn't share a meal with a carnivore. I certainly wouldn't sit next to someone who was committing some grave offense against my sensibilities.

  9. #49
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
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    Yeah. I hate eggs and having my ESFJ lover try an convince me to eat some off her plate totally appalls me and make be insist not on more boundaries on this issue but also red flags other issues of our interactions.

    When it comes down to it its about mutual respect, reasonable toleration and manners.
    I redact everything I have written or will write on this forum prior to, subsequent with and or after the fact of its writing. For entertainment purposes only and not to be taken seriously nor literally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Spamtar - a strange combination of boorish drunkeness and erudite discussions, or what I call "an Irish academic"

  10. #50
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    The dominant side's opinion may be non-dominant for a reason, though. It may be silly or misguided.
    When the non-dominant side's opinion is adopted by the dominant side, it then becomes the dominant opinion. Recognition of illogicality is just one way of this happening.

    It's false earnestness for one. It encourages less debate for another. Mainly, the reason would be that there aren't different rules for the majority and the minority, so the same question could be asked in reverse: "you minority folks, why can't you at least PRETEND to fit in with the group here? Why not keep your dissent to yourselves?" Don't you see why that would be harmful? It doesn't matter if 99% of others agree or 0% of other agree. You have to let people voice their opinions. You DON'T have to make people value the opinions of others.
    What makes earnestness an undeniably good thing, in the first place?

    How are you going to have productive debate when the two sides don't offer each other a baseline level of social consideration, and constantly offend each other in their naked assertions of the other side's folly? These considerations certainly differ given the forum - internet conversations tend to be more brazen than their real-life counterparts, for example.

    Once again, it's unwise to mistake what one thinks should be the case for what actually is the case. Majorities and minorities do have different rules, and the rules applying to the minorities are either imposed by the majority or form in response to the influence of the majority.

    Even the process of trying to change the majority's rules are subsumed under its pressure. Take the Civil Rights Movement, for example. Its biggest gains came under non-violent tactics appealing to the majority's sense of equity. When the majority came to its own cultural determination that it no longer approved of the previous structure and rules, those began to change. However, as soon as the movement became more violent and militant, it took almost no time for increased repression based on issues of "law and order".

    Voicing one's opinion in the real world is fine. Voicing one's opinion and being a prick about it is another. No one is forcing you to respect someone else's opinion. It's just that cultural sensibilities indicate that it's not a good thing to be a douchebag about that fact. Once again, that doesn't apply if you think that opinion is ultimately harmful to others.

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