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  1. #21
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    The point is, is that you have no stage 2 or alternative in mind. Everything about government is up for debate, as it should be, but not many rational people are arguing to abolish our liberal democracy.
    Neither am I. I am simply pointing out that it's not Shangri La and never has been.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  2. #22
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Neither am I. I am simply pointing out that it's not Shangri La and never has been.
    I thought you were pointing out that it's a bunch of hooey and has never accomplished anything.

    If you're pro-democracy, then don't be so anti-democracy.

  3. #23
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    I thought you were pointing out that it's a bunch of hooey and has never accomplished anything.

    If you're pro-democracy, then don't be so anti-democracy.
    I'm neither and all attempts to classify me into one camp or another have failed thus far. I refuse to kowtow to some new form of religion so that I can have my free will and choice of compliance taken away. I am neither conservative nor liberal nor labour. I don't support green nor BNP nor any other group.

    I make a decision based on the parameters which are apparent at the point of the decision and the experience I have of previous circumstances.

    You might say I'm an activist for the free thinkers party. We take all the other parties, stick them in a blender and then strain them until something useful emerges. And yes I am down about democracy because I'm familiar with the crimes people pass of with nought more than a "yeah but whaddya gonna do? It's the best we've got".
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  4. #24
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    If you're pro-democracy, then don't be so anti-democracy.
    He's pointing out the flaws in the idea of democracy, not saying it should be abolished. He may only want to find ways to improve or modify the implementation of the idea, in order to find ways to emphasize the positive aspects while negating or trying to cancel out the negative aspects.

    Being critical of something is not the same as wanting to eliminate or replace it. There's no creativity in looking at things so dualistically.

  5. #25
    Crazy Diamond Billy's Avatar
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    I appreciate Democracy for what it is, but when the zombie apocalypse happens I am totally becoming a war lord and establishing a new monarchy.

  6. #26
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    I refuse to kowtow to some new form of religion so that I can have my free will and choice of compliance taken away.
    It's a great thing you live in a democracy and are allowed to do that.

  7. #27
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    It's a great thing you live in a democracy and are allowed to do that.
    Lol. Nice try sonny but that liberty is mine. I claim it by refusing the group think. It is not gifted to me by some system nor government, freedom never is.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  8. #28
    Senior Member Ruthie's Avatar
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    First - kind of ironic that you cited Mencken's quote in the argument. I spent the better part of last night debating Mencken with my sister-in-law (she's fairly pro, I'm very much anti-Mencken). Actually, he's the one Baltimorean I would rather my city not claim.

    Second, it always strikes me that the same people who complain about "the ignorance of the masses" always want to draw a bold line between Pop Culture/Entertainment and News/Politics. I think the greater the line between the two, the more we divide into a couple of groups: the handful who listen to NPR, read policy publications, watch C-Span, follow international news; and the rest of the people who would find that god-awful boring.

    This is where I think the fuzzy boundaries between news and entertainment are actually good for democracy. For a lot of people, late-night monologues and sensationalism are an easy starting point to begin to relate to topical issues.

    Far from buying Mencken, I don't even agree with Churchill: "democracy is the worst form of government... except for all the other forms." I don't see democracy as a necessary evil at all. I believe in the wisdom of crowds, and think we need more people (rather than fewer) participating in the process.

  9. #29
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Let's be sure to clarify between a democracy (which doesn't exist anywhere in the world) and a representative democracy (which are most developed countries). The representatives are supposed to be a last line of defense between pure majoritarian rule and what we have today.

  10. #30
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Lol. Nice try sonny but that liberty is mine. I claim it by refusing the group think. It is not gifted to me by some system nor government, freedom never is.
    You can claim it, but others can take it. Legal rights protect it.

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