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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    I didn't say she was talented. I said she was useful and successful. There are THOUSANDS of people who are untalented and wealthy. You obviously dislike her because of her inherited wealth, and that is a stupid way to be.
    What are you going on about now? It has nothing to do with her inherited wealth. If Paris Hilton inherited wealth and she was an intelligent, talented, and/or decent human being I might admire her. I'm certain that there are plenty of people who inherited wealth that I like or admire. Your argument is invalid.

    Oh...I have a couple of good ones, actually: Kate Hudson is prettier, Gwyneth Paltrow is a better actress, Frances Bean Cobain is cooler, and one of my friends who had a trust fund is both smarter and nicer.

    What exactly is unethical about making money in the entertainment industry again? And she did receive some decent education before she got expelled from school. I don't really come down on people too hard for breaking the rules at snooty prep schools. I did it all through high school myself (although I didn't have the luxury of ordering limos to campus). She did manage to get her GED.
    So what if she managed to get her GED? She had more than adequate opportunity. There are people from the projects who get PhDs, so I'm not into handing Paris a cookie for doing something less than the average person does, which includes graduating high school.

    In fact, I know two people who got their GED and went to college afterward. So I'm really not impressed with her GED. Next.





    Soooooo. . . do you ever stop being ignorant?
    In some areas I have more knowledge than you do. You seem extremely ignorant to me at times as well.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    What are you going on about now? It has nothing to do with her inherited wealth. If Paris Hilton inherited wealth and she was an intelligent, talented, and/or decent human being I might admire her. I'm certain that there are plenty of people who inherited wealth that I like or admire. Your argument is invalid.
    How do you know she isn't a decent human being? I've seen a couple of stupid comments and DUI/driving without a license convictions.


    Oh...I have a couple of good ones, actually: Kate Hudson is prettier, Gwyneth Paltrow is a better actress, Frances Bean Cobain is cooler, and one of my friends who had a trust fund is both smarter and nicer.
    And none of that matters when it comes to their "usefulness." You don't get to decide someone's worth. Our marketplace has decided her economic value, and she deserves every penny she makes. It's not as if she is Bernie Madoff or Lou Pearlman, defrauding people left and right.


    So what if she managed to get her GED? She had more than adequate opportunity. There are people from the projects who get PhDs, so I'm not into handing Paris a cookie for doing something less than the average person does, which includes graduating high school.

    In fact, I know two people who got their GED and went to college afterward. So I'm really not impressed with her GED. Next.
    GED's aren't really impressive, so I don't get your point. I was just saying that she at least bothered.


    In some areas I have more knowledge than you do. You seem extremely ignorant to me at times as well.
    Such as? I haven't really seen much evidence to that effect. You just don't like Paris Hilton. That is fine, but it's really not on her.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post


    And who made you the arbiter of "usefulness?" .

    I would also like to take a moment to seperately address the hypocrisy in this statement. You apparently find yourself to be the arbiter of "usefulness" since you believe that millions of people don't "deserve" health care et al.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Wife runs in, checks out young daughter and, having ascertained that the four-year-old is fine, proceeds to get upset over the broken bin. "We can't afford to replace this right now!" she moans, which is correct, if unhelpful.
    Really? Wow. I have some large plastic bins to spare if you need them. They're like, $15-$20 a piece. I'm sorry to hear you're so hard up.

    You know, if it's really that much of an issue, maybe you should think about getting rid of the dogs.

    Enter my fifteen-year-old daughter, a.k.a. The Cruel Queen. In a snide tone of voice she tells her mother... to her face, mind you... "Stop crying over a stupid dog food bin. We'll buy another one."
    Aww, that's kind of mean.

    Before wife can respond, I'm in the room saying "[Daughter], you're not allowed to talk to your mother that way. Get out of the kitchen." My primary goal at this point is to separate mother from daughter so it doesn't turn into a real argument.
    Hmm... well, that was good damage control, but I wonder whether it would have taught her more of a lesson to actually piss her mother off, and then have her mom decide her punishment while still mad at her (which would likely have been quite severe), hold her to it, AND deal with her mother having it in for her for a while. It would have been more stressful for everyone, but it would have hit home more about why you don't talk to people that way.

    Then again, it's easy to say that when you don't have to deal with the fallout.

    I'm there to see her do what I've told her to do. It was a "we're not having this conversation" moment, and not particularly ENTP of me if I do say.
    Yep. You know, it's too bad that parenting tactics always seem to end up reverting to the "do as I say" stuff when people are under stress. That's just how people work, no way around it. It resolves the situation temporarily, and intimdates them into submission, but in the long run... all it teaches them is that you don't approve. If they don't know or care why it's wrong in and of itself, well... you can guess what will happen when you're not around.

    In less stressful situations, it might pay to try and illustrate reasoning for things.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Our marketplace has decided her economic value.
    This sums up your entire argument. It has nothing to do with Paris Hilton. Which is exactly the point of my original post: I don't agree that our current marketplace fairly decides people's economic value. I also don't think that current standards of economic value determine a person's total worth. Apparently you do. Alas, we are never going to agree. I'm not entirely sure why you even responded to my post. You didn't "win" you just kind of made yourself seem like an ad hominem wielding libertarian creep par usual.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    This sums up your entire argument. It has nothing to do with Paris Hilton. Which is exactly the point of my original post: I don't agree that our current marketplace fairly decides people's economic value. I also don't think that current standards of economic value determine a person's total worth. Apparently you do. Alas, we are never going to agree. I'm not entirely sure why you even responded to my post. You didn't "win" you just kind of made yourself seem like an ad hominem wielding libertarian creep par usual.
    How would the marketplace "fairly" decide someone's economic value? Is it unfair that Alex Rodriguez makes like $28 million to play a game? Of course not. And here is something you do not get: YOU are the one who is determining someone's worth as a human being. I am not. I said Paris Hilton deserves to be a millionaire many times over, because she is productive in the economy. I never said she was a good person, a good role model, or even particularly polite and nice. I know someone who knows her, but I've never met her in my life. I wouldn't know if she is nice to be around. YOU were the one claimed that she is not "useful," had no decency, and so on. You're the one with the problem here.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    I would also like to take a moment to seperately address the hypocrisy in this statement. You apparently find yourself to be the arbiter of "usefulness" since you believe that millions of people don't "deserve" health care et al.
    Nothing hypocritical at all. People "deserve" health care. They do not have a RIGHT to health care, and they certainly do not have a right to have it at the expense of other people's tax dollars. Your argument is a complete non sequitur. Paris Hilton doesn't have a RIGHT to be a millionairess or role model. She HAS a right to work to earn money for herself, and her rich parents had a right to give her a lavish lifestyle growing up, the same way Warren Buffett has a right to have raised his children in a more frugal manner. It's his money to have disbursed as he sees fit, as long as he provided his minor children with a safe household, food, etc.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    How would the marketplace "fairly" decide someone's economic value? Is it unfair that Alex Rodriguez makes like $28 million to play a game? Of course not. And here is something you do not get: YOU are the one who is determining someone's worth as a human being. I am not. I said Paris Hilton deserves to be a millionaire many times over, because she is productive in the economy. I never said she was a good person, a good role model, or even particularly polite and nice. I know someone who knows her, but I've never met her in my life. I wouldn't know if she is nice to be around. YOU were the one claimed that she is not "useful," had no decency, and so on. You're the one with the problem here.
    No, I'm not the one with the problem. You see, you believe in the system and I do not. You run under the assumption that because you believe that our current system works that it is the "right" system, or it is the system which should be in place. I certainly can have an opinion as to whom I think as useful, just as you have your own smug opinion that working class people without health insurance apparently aren't "useful" enough to society to merit medical care. To me that is a much greater error in attempting to determine someone's basic worth as a human being, their sheer right to exist and be healthy. I never once claimed that Paris Hilton should die, be denied health care or food or shelter or education, or otherwise be exposed to danger or violence. I said that our society is sick for rewarding her financially for being what she is. That is my opinion. Opinions cannot be proven. I'm not sure exactly what you were trying to prove with your defense of her monetary gain, other than you believe that she "deserves" to be given large amounts of money for doing next to nothing. There are many people who are much more productive in our economy who do not earn what Paris Hilton makes. No, her net worth is not proportionate to her so-called "productivity."

    So I don't have "a problem." I have a different way of seeing the world than you do. For example, by observing this thread you seem to believe that Chinese CEOs are going to take over. You also appear to have a deeply arrogant belief in your own store of knowledge, even to the point of not admitting that you might be ignorant in some areas in which I am proficient.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Nothing hypocritical at all. People "deserve" health care. They do not have a RIGHT to health care, and they certainly do not have a right to have it at the expense of other people's tax dollars. Your argument is a complete non sequitur. Paris Hilton doesn't have a RIGHT to be a millionairess or role model. She HAS a right to work to earn money for herself, and her rich parents had a right to give her a lavish lifestyle growing up, the same way Warren Buffett has a right to have raised his children in a more frugal manner. It's his money to have disbursed as he sees fit, as long as he provided his minor children with a safe household, food, etc.
    Wait, rich people have rights and poor people don't? What?

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    Wait, rich people have rights and poor people don't? What?
    Everyone has the same rights. That's why they are called "rights" and not "privileges." These rights do not include a right to publicly-funded health care. You may want them to include it, but they do not.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

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