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  1. #71
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    That's fine, but it's a difference in basic values that results in these political differences between people, not just simple lack of education.
    I would like to agree there, but there are also left-wing zealots who believe in material equality EVEN when it's proven to make the world worse off economically. The "values" in this case would be counterproductive, if not outright destructive. Values can be wrong.


    There are also higher rates of atheism among people with more education, but it wouldn't be fair of me to implicitly call religion uneducated on that basis and imply that most religious people would give up their faith if they studied a little science.

    That's insulting, condescending and self-righteous and I hope you see why.

    You could call the median atheist more educated than the median believer and it would be accurate, though, would it not? There is also the difference of there being no reliable data to answer the question of theism. We have hundreds of years of data with which to examine examine political and economic issues. There are reasons why no one with a brain takes communism or national socialism seriously in 2009.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  2. #72
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    Pure Merc shouldn't have to face you hell hounds alone so I will join in the fray.

    America will ultimately not be able to continue spending money like we are and remain a first world power.

    As our debt increases, the percentage of our GDP that has to go to paying it off increases. As the % of GDP that has to go to paying off the debt increases, our ability as a nation to finance new gov't programs decreases.

    As we continue to create expansionist gov't programs, despite our growing inability to pay for them, the gov't will have one of two options.

    1) raise taxes: this option can work, but given the nature of American politics, and how taboo and unpopular it is to raise them (at least on everyone, no one gives a shit when its just done on the rich), the government will probably punt on this issue. The gov't may raise taxes, but they will be kept from raising them enough to make a difference by the middle class on down.

    2) outsource our debt to foreign countries willing finance it: this option, is infinitely more attractive to gov't because, it is a financial concept beyond the understanding of your average voter. Also, it allows the gov't to maintain the facade that everything is fine, and thereby, guarantee that the incumbent seats within congress will be maintained.

    This second option, is much like using an anesthetic on a injured patient, but then forgoing the surgery afterwords. In the short term, it allows the government to keep spending the US out of house and home without anyone being the wiser, but in the long run it can only serve to weaken the position of the US relative to other nations on the world stage.

    Luckily for congress, the check hasn't come due yet on all this cash it owes. We can make the minimum payments on it for a while at least.

    But as our ability to pay this debt decreases, foreign nations will become less and less confident in the dollar, and the capability of the US pay them what is owed.

    Even this won't really affect the way the public sees gov't spending.

    What it is going to take for people to realize that we can't spend like we are is a complete collapse of the dollar which will happen if we keep doing what we are doing. Once the foreign nations have lost confidence in the dollar and the US, they will cease to willingly finance our debt. Once that happens it will be too late to employ option one.

    Thus, by continuing to, finance ridiculous gov't programs, maintain three costly wars (those being in Afghanistan, Iraq [which we still have a significant amount of troops in by the way], and the war on drugs), and bailout businesses that would be better off dissolving, the US government is consciously depriving our country of any ability to remain a first world power.

    That is how I (and I am a strong libertarian) view our economic situation. If you can refute this go ahead, I'm all ears.

  3. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    That is how I (and I am a strong libertarian) view our economic situation. If you can refute this go ahead, I'm all ears.
    It seems to me that the only danger is to the Reserve Currency of the World, the USA dollar.

    Saddam threatened the Reserve Currency of the World by trying to sell his oil in euros. And for his pains he was dragged from his spider hole by a junior officer and hanged.

    After WW II they wouldn't even hang the Emperor of Japan although we wanted to hang him as a war criminal.

    No, the Emperor of Japan did not threaten the Reserve Currency of the World, he merely committed more war crimes than the Fuhrer.

    And it's true, just the other day, the Governor of the Reserve Bank of China, did call for the replacement of the USA dollar as the Reserve Currency of the World.

    Of course the Governor of the Reserve Bank of China would like to replace the USA dollar with his own currency, the Renminbi. And if the truth be told would even be prepared to go to war to achieve this mercantile goal. But the chances of the world accepting the Renminbi as the Reserve Currency are minimal.

    So the USA will continue to own and control and print the Reserve Currency of the World.

    I think we can all relax.

  4. #74
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    We may want to work on stopping the continuous debasement of that Reserve Currency, though.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    We may want to work on stopping the continuous debasement of that Reserve Currency, though.
    Of course your dollar is our Reserve Currency.

    And at the moment we are moving up to parity with the Reserve Currency and we expect to reach $US1.10 before long.

    This is of course a reflection of the strength of our economy. Our banks are well capitalised and required no bail out during your economic failure.

    In fact we were the only developed country not to go into recession. And our Reserve Bank has just raised interest rates so that we won't overheat during the next boom.

    But our success depends on you owning, controlling and printing the Reserve Currency. And we are quite bullish as we see no threat to the Reserve Currency.

    Sure, your dollar is going down and ours is going up, for we share floating currencies.

    And the ups and downs are economic signals to guide us on our way.

    The economic train remains on track and there will be no train wreck.

  6. #76
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    Saddam threatened the Reserve Currency of the World by trying to sell his oil in euros. And for his pains he was dragged from his spider hole by a junior officer and hanged.
    Because we handed him over to the Iraqi people to be held accountable for his crimes.

    So the USA will continue to own and control and print the Reserve Currency of the World.

    I think we can all relax.
    We need to let the IMF bind with the UN to create a non-partisan 3rd party multinational governmental organization which oversees the conduct of nations. It could create its own currency which would be held in reserve.

  7. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    Because we handed him over to the Iraqi people to be held accountable for his crimes.
    In exactly the same way the Church handed over heretics to the Temporal Authorities for burning.

    And of course Saddam wasn't hanged for this crimes against the Iraqi people, he was hanged for posing a real threat to the Reserve Currency.

    I mean what would have happened if Saudi Arabia had followed suit and started to sell their oil in euros?

    It would have been a real threat to power relations. And such a threat is casus belli so we went to war and pulled him out of his spider hole. And the power relations of the world were saved.

    And this is why we went to war together with you, for our prosperity is built on our present power relations.

    And just as at the end of a Shakespearean play the natural order of events is restored.

    God save the Queen and America too.

  8. #78
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    And of course Saddam wasn't hanged for this crimes against the Iraqi people, he was hanged for posing a real threat to the Reserve Currency.
    What you say may have played a fairly significant role in his execution, but that is not the whole story.

    In April 1991, after Saddam lost control of Kuwait in the Persian Gulf War, he cracked down ruthlessly against several uprisings in the Kurdish north and the Shia south. His forces committed wholesale massacres and other gross human rights violations against both groups similar to the violations mentioned before. Estimates of deaths during that time range from 20,000 to 100,000 for Kurds, and 60,000 to 130,000 for Shi'ites.

    Al-Anfal Campaign: In 1988, the Hussein regime began a campaign of extermination against the Kurdish people living in Northern Iraq. This is known as the Anfal campaign. The campaign was mostly directed at Shiite kurds (Faili Kurds) who sided with Iranians during the Iraq-Iran War. The attacks resulted in the death of at least 50,000 (some reports estimate as many as 100,000 people), many of them women and children.
    These are just two of the many genocides committed by Saddam.

    What seems more important, the deaths of Hundreds of Thousands, or the reserve currency?

    What riddle do you have next?

    EDIT: I've hijacked the hell out of this thread. Sorry

  9. #79
    Senior Member iamathousandapples's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    That may be the dumbest argument I've ever heard. When alcohol was illegal in the '20s and early-'30s, people died or went blind from bathtub hooch. If they had tobacco company scientists and botanists working 52 weeks a year, weed would extremely cheap, potent, and readily available.
    I never said it was a good argument, I just said it was an argument. I, myself, want it legalized.

  10. #80
    Priestess Of Syrinx Katsuni's Avatar
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    It's not like they made it legal or anything... they just said, for places where it's NOT illegal... they're not going to waste time charging people for it. When they didn't do anything illegal.

    That's right, they aren't going to charge people for things that aren't crimes anymore >.>;;

    Uhm yeah.

    The forms which ARE crimes, such as use of weapons, drug trafficing, or selling other drugs, well yeah those they WILL keep charging people with. Because... they're illegal.

    They just won't be wasting stupidly large amounts of time and resources hunting down people who literally aren't doing ANYTHING wrong because in the states that're impacted, it's legal IN THOSE STATES to use medicinal marijuana. The states it's not legal in they'll still prosecute though, which's still a waste of time, but at least they're not wasting time charging people who aren't even doing anything illegal >.>;;

    Just seems silly that they ever did in the first place.

    Anyways, for those asking, marijuana's generally not that dangerous. It's not addictive like cigarettes, it's got less toxins than cigarettes, it doesn't often cause yeu to be violent like alcohol, and has relatively few long term drawbacks.

    I've never used it myself so I can't comment on exactly how it works, but I've known enough people who have used it to get a rough idea of the idea behind it. If alcohol makes yeu think yeu can do anything, and yeu drive yeur car at 100 in a 50 zone, then marijuana yeu'll be going 20 and just *THINK* yeu're going 100 >.>

    At least that's my understanding of it XD

    Another good quote on the matter from Dennis Miller.

    "And wouldn't you rather shoot a game of pool with a guy smoking a joint than a guy drinking whiskey and beer? Someone smoking a joint doesn't all of a sudden rear back and stab his partner in the eye socket with the cue stick, okay. He's too busy laughing at the balls."



    Is marijuana "bad" for people? Technically? Yes. Practically? Not especially so. It does impair judgement, so I'd highly suggest avoiding its' use while driving, etc. But in terms of actual damage? Not really, it's probably the safest thing out there, far less so than cigarettes or alcohol.

    Whot does keeping it illegal do?

    - No taxes on a rather high income crop
    - Elevated theft and crime rates for people trying to afford it at inflated rates due to illegal status making it harder to get (supply/demand, need weed, more likely to rob a store to pay for it)
    - Waste of time and effort to track down and prosecute people who really aren't harming anyone
    - IMMENSE waste of resources and taxpayer money on paying for penitentiary terms for prosecuted marijuana smokers (probably 30% or something like that of the people in there are in for stupid crap like this...)
    - In states where it's LEGAL to use medicinal marijuana, people have been being charged on a federal level anyway. Right, a doctor can prescribe it to yeu as a far better alternative of pain relief in comparison to most others, the majority of which are opium based... so the marijuana is far less side effects, and far less risk of addiction or abuse... but yeu can get charged for that, but not for morphine, despite that the doctor could prescribe both. Brilliant. (This's whot's being changed, but ONLY if the doctor prescribes it, and ONLY if it's legal to do so in that state)


    Whot would making marijuana legal do?

    - Severely reduce the costs of penitentiaries
    - Far more useful employees available (many of the best workers I've known tend to relax with weed... criminal record for it can keep them from many jobs...)
    - Large tax income increase from taxing the sale of it
    - Lower health risks due to the possibility of government regulation; ie a dealer won't be tempted to mix in something really nasty like heroine in with it
    - Police will have far more time and resources to devote to 'real' crimes, lowering crime rate indirectly
    - Many of those who were forced to pay ridiculous costs for their habit, will not turn to theft when the prices lower significantly, also reducing crime rate significantly
    - Some who drink alcohol may actually stop and replace it with marijuana due to much lower side effects with similar beneficial effects, reducing alcohol related injuries and deaths likely significantly

    (some bad stuff)
    - Auto accidents from people who are high will increase (still lower than drinking and driving though, due to alcohol's properties of increasing the risk of an accident far moreso than marijuana does)
    - Not everyone will agree with the change, likely causing political backdraft (no reelection probably)
    - Some people who wouldn't've bothered with it before, may now be tempted to
    - Will become more 'accepted' to do so... making it no longer illegal would cause people to do so at times they otherwise wouldn't, or treat it as harmless when it's really not 100% so



    In any case, it's still got side effects, and some of them *CAN* be dangerous in certain circumstances. It's not a 'perfect' drug by any means, but it is nowheres even remotely as bad as alcohol or cigarettes. If anything, COFFEE is probably more dangerous than marijuana if both are overused. That being said, it's stupid that it's persisted this long already. It's more risk to people to keep it, and it's causing alot of indirect crimes which shouldn't even exist, not 'just' the ones directly involving marijuana, but others like theft in relation to supporting the habit. The resources wasted on it are immense, as are the finances thrown away by not taxing such.



    This is an example of where an ENTP's hatred of 'taboo' and 'tradition' comes in. Just because yeu've done something retardedly stupid for over 100 years, doesn't mean it's a good idea to keep doing it. There is virtually no reason NOT to do so, and the few that are, can be regulated and dealt with far easier than alcohol can, so... yeah.

    Anyways, I'll never touch the stuff, if I started, I'd never stop, even if it's not addictive. I can't afford it, and I don't trust anything which affects my conscious thought. I don't even take flu medicine usually, let alone painkillers. But that's because I know my limitations, and they are awfully low on some things like this... I don't drink either, if I started alcohol AT ALL, I'd be an alcoholic definately >.> Some things it's just better not to start using at all if yeu know yeu'd misuse it. However, for people who use marijuana? I've never had any real problems with them. Actually, the ONLY irritating thing I've ever had to deal with them is the incessant "Dude I am soooooo high right now" statements they seem to insist on using. Seriously, I don't care, don't tell me. But that's actually the ONLY thing I've seen that annoys me from marijuana users. Drunk people can really worry me, they can be violent, or scary in other ways. One of my BF's was really drunk once, and they got ridiculously depressed from it, really scared me at the time to see that... and some people get abusive, physically or verbally, and sometimes sexually when drunk... lack of inhibition is a bad thing. I'd much rather ban alcohol and make marijuana legal, it's by far the lesser evil of the two. And people will *ALWAYS* use something to alter consciousness no matter whot yeu do... I'd rather it be the safest option available.

    Anyways, ranting now XD

    Weed's not "good" as such, but it has minimal side effects, and there's vast benefits to de-criminalize it's use, growth, and sale. FAR more problems are caused by NOT legalizing it, than by maintaining it's illegal status. But that's politics and society for yeu. Inefficiency and danger for the greater harm!

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