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  1. #1
    Was E.laur Laurie's Avatar
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    Default No knives in schools...

    What in the world are people thinking now?

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/12/ed...o_interstitial

    NEWARK, Del. Finding character witnesses when you are 6 years old is not easy. But there was Zachary Christie last week at a school disciplinary committee hearing with his karate instructor and his mothers fianc by his side to vouch for him.

    Zacharys offense? Taking a camping utensil that can serve as a knife, fork and spoon to school. He was so excited about recently joining the Cub Scouts that he wanted to use it at lunch. School officials concluded that he had violated their zero-tolerance policy on weapons, and Zachary was suspended and now faces 45 days in the districts reform school.

  2. #2
    Kraken down on piracy Lux's Avatar
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    I realize they're trying to keep people safe but, there are shades of gray. That poor 6 year old kid.

  3. #3
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    yeah, first it's a hobo tool then it's an ak74.
    “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I’m here to tell you that fast is better. I’ve always believed this, in spite of the trouble it’s caused me. Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba…”


  4. #4
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaybeLogic View Post
    yeah, first it's a hobo tool then it's an ak74.
    lol
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  5. #5
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    This was the parent's fault for not recognizing that it could be thought of as a weapon. There are little kids that do harm to others with knives. There would be no need for such a policy in the first place, if that weren't true.

    Suspension and reform school is ridiculous, unless he was actually caught trying to hurt someone. Or had previously threatened to.

  6. #6
    Oberon
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    Zero-tolerance policies are what happens when school policy is subject to political pressure. In pre-zero-tolerance stage, a kid gets suspended for doing something obviously harmful with an obvious weapon. His mama raises hell in the district, files a lawsuit against the teacher, the principal, the school, and the district, and goes to war in the newspapers over what was, really, a slam-dunk judgment call on the part of an administrator. So, in order to protect themselves, schools and districts pass "zero tolerance" policies. Their purpose is to protect administrators from the public by taking the judgment call out of the administrator's hands. "It's not my fault," the principal can say. "I have to follow district policy."

    The problem here isn't that there was a hobo tool at school. The problem isn't even that there was a zero-tolerance policy. The problem is that politics can influence what should be an educational system. That's the Achilles' Heel of public education, and cannot be avoided under a democratic form of government.

    That's one of the many reasons we homeschool. Politics can't get a grip on our policy decisions, and anyway if our kids need weapons, or even tools that double as weapons, we have enough in the house and the tool shed to provide each kid with two or three apiece.

    My nine-year-old has his own pocket knife, his own sheath knife for hunting, his own hatchet, and access to the family's machete. He's a camping fool.

  7. #7
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    ^ This whole "I wash my hands of responsibility with this printed rule" bullshit has caused a lot of trouble and will continue to screw over innocent people because a few are just waiting to jump on the lawsuit bandwagon.

    What ends up happening is the school focuses so much on protecting themselves from this asses, that kids like this end up hurt in the process and eventually parents from this end will start to sue out of necessity.

    I agree with Binary on the fact that the adults should have been aware, but if I were a kid I could easily see myself slipping that into my pocket for lunch and thinking nothing of it and not bothering to tell mommy and daddy because, afterall, it's just utensils.
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  8. #8
    Senior Member Bushranger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    I agree with Binary on the fact that the adults should have been aware, but if I were a kid I could easily see myself slipping that into my pocket for lunch and thinking nothing of it and not bothering to tell mommy and daddy because, afterall, it's just utensils.
    What's that? The emperor has no clothes?

    From the article:
    For Zachary, it is not school violence that has left him reluctant to return to classes.

    I just think the other kids may tease me for being in trouble, he said, pausing before adding, but I think the rules are what is wrong, not me.
    What they are doing is raising a generation marred by institutionalised bullying. Society undermining the authority of law by putting justice out of reach of those who stand to learn the most from it.
    In thirty years you could end up with a lot of anarchists. The question is whether they will be the ruling or the rebel class.
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  9. #9
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushranger View Post
    What's that? The emperor has no clothes?

    What they are doing is raising a generation marred by institutionalised bullying. Society undermining the authority of law by putting justice out of reach of those who stand to learn the most from it.
    In thirty years you could end up with a lot of anarchists. The question is whether they will be the ruling or the rebel class.
    Yep... we could see a groundswell of libertarianism.

  10. #10
    Was E.laur Laurie's Avatar
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    My daughter said at her elementary that you get suspended for bringing a pocket knife but probably would just get a knife/fork/spoon taken away. I know someone who was threatened to hurt kids with an epi pen he brought who got suspended (rightfully)

    We were told that in Ohio now they have to report bullying, just like they to have to report sexual abuse.

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