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  1. #131
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    lol I am enjoying it, even if it's totally off topic. =D
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  2. #132
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    By the way, I forgot merc asked for a concrete example, so here's one:

    "I don't have any children. I don't know why any of my tax money should go to public schools--I have no way of benefitting from that service at all, so why should my money go to support it?"

    It baffles me how people can take this and turn it into "public education is inherently flawed." Does that not strike you as a wee bit short-sighted?
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  3. #133
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Okay, here:

    My post used exaggerated humor to illustrate a point about the impracticality of Libertarian philosophy. This is a common technique in satire.
    Except your post was completely off base. You accomplished nothing but wasting peoples' time.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  4. #134
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    By the way, I forgot merc asked for a concrete example, so here's one:

    "I don't have any children. I don't know why any of my tax money should go to public schools--I have no way of benefitting from that service at all, so why should my money go to support it?"

    It baffles me how people can take this and turn it into "public education is inherently flawed." Does that not strike you as a wee bit short-sighted?

    Libertarians who believe that there should be no public education don't believe that because they don't have children. They believe it because children can still be educated without the government being involved.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  5. #135
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Libertarians who believe that there should be no public education don't believe that because they don't have children. They believe it because children can still be educated without the government being involved.
    Uh huh, and rich children get the good education = zero class mobility.

    If you think education should be purely privatized I'm afraid you are living in a fantasy.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  6. #136
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Uh huh, and rich children get the good education = zero class mobility.
    Rich children already get the good education. Either they go to private schools, or their parents live in an area with superior public school districts.


    If you think education should be purely privatized I'm afraid you are living in a fantasy.

    I don't believe that, but I wouldn't mind getting rid of the Department of Education as a Cabinet-level federal department. And, as I have noted before, primary and secondary education (dominated by government schools) is lackluster compared to other rich countries. American colleges and universities (private or state-funded, but under far less government direction) are the envy of the world.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  7. #137
    Senior Member therationaledge's Avatar
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    My girlfriend was home schooled by her single poor mother, and has scored higher on every imagianable test she has ever taken than anyone else I know.

    And the answer is no, she isnt like some savant or anythign, her mom just taught her well.

    But the level of different people learning would be drastic, plus what one person learns could be drastically different than another

    Creationism in one household and evolution in another keeps coming to mind.
    "You would lose your money," Sherlock Holmes remarked calmly. "As for the article I wrote it myself."

    "You!"

    "Yes, I have a turn both for observation and for deduction. The theories which I have expressed there, and which appear to you to be so chimerical are really extremely practical -- so practical that I depend upon them for my bread and cheese."

  8. #138
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Rich children already get the good education. Either they go to private schools, or their parents live in an area with superior public school districts.
    Yes, because our public school system is hopelessly underfunded. I'll offer Japan as a good example--they pay their public schoolteachers like doctors so that it's actually a competitive field where really good teachers actually want the jobs. If you're going to socialize something like education, you have to just bite the bullet and tax enough that you can put enough money into it to pay the teachers well.

    That doesn't mean we need to do away with public education; here's another example of the common Libertarian mistake of throwing out the baby with the bathwater.





    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    I don't believe that, but I wouldn't mind getting rid of the Department of Education as a Cabinet-level federal department. And, as I have noted before, primary and secondary education (dominated by government schools) is lackluster compared to other rich countries. American colleges and universities (private or state-funded, but under far less government direction) are the envy of the world.
    Once again, due entirely to underfunding. Easily fixable.

    Can you explain how totally privatized education would work out? I don't see that as helping anything so much as making socioeconomic divides even bigger/worse/more permanent.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  9. #139
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Once again, due entirely to underfunding. Easily fixable.

    Can you explain how totally privatized education would work out? I don't see that as helping anything so much as making socioeconomic divides even bigger/worse/more permanent.
    If you don't believe in the just world hypothesis, none of the justification will make any sense to you.

    There are two distinctly different languages being spoken here.

  10. #140
    Senior Member reason's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Yes, because our public school system is hopelessly underfunded.
    Hahahahaha ... please, stop, you're killing me!

    I forget the numbers now, but the U.S. education system, adjusted for inflation, costs many times more per-pupil today than it did three decades ago. But guess what? Education hasn't improved. The last three decades demonstrate that pumping more money into the system is like dropping it into a black hole. The problem is the system itself, and not a lack of funding.

    A gas guzzling engine will not use fuel more efficiently by adding more gas, and neither will the U.S. education system.

    On the other hand, perhaps children have just gotten many times more stupid and education spending is just keeping up.
    A criticism that can be brought against everything ought not to be brought against anything.

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