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Thread: Healthcare

  1. #11
    Senior Member LostInNerSpace's Avatar
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    What happens when we run out of money? Who will pay for the healthcare? You might say, let's tax the huge corporation who make too much money. It won't work. They will find ways around paything those taxes; possibly moving operations abroad which means they pay even less tax.

    Also, we have too many other things to take care of. The looming social security obligation will cost far more than healthcare. We have still not addressed that issue.

  2. #12
    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LostInNerSpace View Post
    What happens when we run out of money? Who will pay for the healthcare? You might say, let's tax the huge corporation who make too much money. It won't work. They will find ways around paything those taxes; possibly moving operations abroad which means they pay even less tax.

    Also, we have too many other things to take care of. The looming social security obligation will cost far more than healthcare. We have still not addressed that issue.
    I second this.

    If you pull one chord, you'll only be shortening another.
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

  3. #13
    Senior Member LostInNerSpace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneWithSoul View Post
    Agreed.

    It's all business. It's almost impossible to have something for the people these days.
    No. Everyone can be covered. But we need realistic expectations about what we can have. The real problem is everyone wants everything. People are not willing to give up a little bit of choice to save money.

  4. #14
    Senior Member avolkiteshvara's Avatar
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    Saw the head of the AMA this yesterday morn on MSNBC. Host pretty much tore up the AMA arguement all up ala Jon Stewart style.

    Pretty funny.


    Paul Krugman has some interesting things to say about fee for service; payment for services rather than results.


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  5. #15
    I am Sofa King!!! kendoiwan's Avatar
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    Wars good, pay for wars. Healthcare bad, don't pay for healthcare.
    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...ml#post1161526

    "They the type of cats who pollute the whole shoreline. Have it purified. Sell it for a $1.25"

  6. #16
    Senior Member LostInNerSpace's Avatar
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    I do believe we need healthcare. I believe we should to cover everyone. We need the public plan. The "competition" sales pitch and "reminding people insurance companies are in it for the money" sounds familiar. We should probably even push hard to go all the way with the public plan because we will likely end up with some compromise. I am a realist. I'm sure people will be like whenever I say Republicans have one good idea. Most of their ideas suck--I especially don't like the health savings account.

    Making it pass is a whole different ballgame. You don't tell your opponents what you want. You try to get everything. If we think it will cost a trillion, we should ask for 1.5 or 2 trillion. Then when we cut back to $900 million it seems like a bargain.

  7. #17
    movin melodies kiddykat's Avatar
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    Healthcare.. I find the words health/care to not really go together anymore. Least from my perspective.

    I remember when I was in high school way long ago and worked as a rec leader at an after school program working with children.. Caught tonsillitis. Had it for 6 months. Was on my 3rd round of antibiotics/was always susceptible to strep throat infections.

    That being said, I had white/black puss growing on my tonsils kept progressing worse and worse for more than 3 months. I cried and cried all night, because it was so painful to even swallow. Fevers were pretty common.

    I asked my primary physician if there was a way that I get a referral to the ENT to get my tonsils removed.. I was tearing up, and barely could talk.

    He looks at me square int he face and says, "You need to get on 4 more rounds of antibiotics, THEN, I can send referral papers."

    Mind you- my symptoms were CHRONIC. It didn't matter if I was on antibiotics, because it was incurable. Where's the care in healthcare? Ethics?

    I was a sophomore in high school at that time- Study time, work, sleeping, eating were all critical for me to function/peform well..

    Finally, I got tired, broke down in front of the doctor's office. I was in so much pain. Barely could talk, and my eyes were red/swollen. I cried, asked if there was ABSOLUTELY any way I could get referral to the ENT. I guess the doctor felt humiliated, since other patients could see that I was in pain. He finally wrote me a referral slip. Maybe he did out out of guilt/or not wanting a bad rep? He had authority all that time to write a referral, but I was at the mercy of some ludicrous mumbo jumbo the insurance company put me through.

    I got what I needed, only after I had to beg on my hands/knees for my tonsils to get removed. It was awful. Mind you, we dished out at least $175/per month for HMO (thanks to my step-dad's corporation who paid for the other portion of the medical insurance).

    Yeah- That is what happened. I will never forget. I get too scared to go to the doctor's nowadays. My experience.

  8. #18
    Senior Member LostInNerSpace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Viv View Post

    I asked my primary physician if there was a way that I get a referral to the ENT to get my tonsils removed.. I was tearing up, and barely could talk.

    He looks at me square int he face and says, "You need to get on 4 more rounds of antibiotics, THEN, I can send referral papers."

    Mind you- my symptoms were CHRONIC. It didn't matter if I was on antibiotics, because it was incurable. Where's the care in healthcare? Ethics?
    So basically you are saying the healthcare system is broken because you wanted to second guess your doctor?

    It's broken for a lot of reasons. This might be one of them. People see some med or treatment advetised on TV and tell their doctor they want that treatment.

    Patient: Doctor, doctor, I have a toothache, I need a CAT scan now.
    Doctor: You should really see a dentist
    Patient: No, I need a cat scan.
    Doctor: Ok, just so you don't sue me I'll write a prescription for a cat scan--what the heck, these prescription notepads don't cost me anything.

  9. #19
    Senior Member avolkiteshvara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Viv View Post
    Healthcare.. I find the words health/care to not really go together anymore. Least from my perspective.

    I remember when I was in high school way long ago and worked as a rec leader at an after school program working with children.. Caught tonsillitis. Had it for 6 months. Was on my 3rd round of antibiotics/was always susceptible to strep throat infections.

    That being said, I had white/black puss growing on my tonsils kept progressing worse and worse for more than 3 months. I cried and cried all night, because it was so painful to even swallow. Fevers were pretty common.

    I asked my primary physician if there was a way that I get a referral to the ENT to get my tonsils removed.. I was tearing up, and barely could talk.

    He looks at me square int he face and says, "You need to get on 4 more rounds of antibiotics, THEN, I can send referral papers."

    Mind you- my symptoms were CHRONIC. It didn't matter if I was on antibiotics, because it was incurable. Where's the care in healthcare? Ethics?

    I was a sophomore in high school at that time- Study time, work, sleeping, eating were all critical for me to function/peform well..

    Finally, I got tired, broke down in front of the doctor's office. I was in so much pain. Barely could talk, and my eyes were red/swollen. I cried, asked if there was ABSOLUTELY any way I could get referral to the ENT. I guess the doctor felt humiliated, since other patients could see that I was in pain. He finally wrote me a referral slip. Maybe he did out out of guilt/or not wanting a bad rep? He had authority all that time to write a referral, but I was at the mercy of some ludicrous mumbo jumbo the insurance company put me through.

    I got what I needed, only after I had to beg on my hands/knees for my tonsils to get removed. It was awful. Mind you, we dished out at least $175/per month for HMO (thanks to my step-dad's corporation who paid for the other portion of the medical insurance).

    Yeah- That is what happened. I will never forget. I get too scared to go to the doctor's nowadays. My experience.
    Doctors at HMO actually get bonuses to keep referrals to specialists under a certain %. That combined with the general practitioner ego that they can cure anything, is probably why you had to fight so hard.

    I always do my research before I see a GP. I expect to get into arguments. If you can be a pain in the ass enough, you can usually get what you want.

  10. #20
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Normal market mechanisms do not work when you have perfectly inelastic demand, such as with health care. The profit incentive would be to either increase prices or reduce supply at the same price level, which will hold given the unchanging demand (in the absence of a major epidemic, the number of people utilizing health care remains consistent with population growth year-to-year, since you're not going to choose against health care if the other option is dying or excruciating pain).

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