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  1. #1

    Default Neighborhoods and the Black-White Mobility Gap

    I have a bunch of political style things I want to explore...I will TRY to refrain from spamming the forum.

    I think the most interesting is the following report from the Pew Charitable Trusts.

    Neighborhoods and the Black-White Mobility Gap - The Pew Charitable Trusts
    http://www.pewtrusts.org/uploadedFil...v12.pdf?n=1399

    From the actual Report:
    One of the most powerful findings of the Economic Mobility Project’s research to date has been the striking mobility gap between blacks and whites in America. This report explores one potentially important factor behind the black-white mobility gap: the impact of neighborhood poverty rates experienced during childhood. Using the Panel Study of Income Dynamics (PSID), the report focuses on blacks and whites born from 1955-1970, following them from childhood into adulthood. The first section of the paper investigates relative intergenerational mobility; whether neighborhood poverty in childhood impacts the ability of both black and white adults to move up or down the income ladder relative to the position their parents held. The second section investigates whether changes in neighborhood poverty rates experienced by black children affected their adult incomes, earnings, and wealth. Finally, the third section provides an overview of the possible policy implications of the results.

    Experiencing high neighborhood poverty throughout childhood strongly increases the risk of falling down the income ladder.

    • For children whose family income is in the top three quintiles, spending childhood in a high-poverty neighborhood versus a low-poverty neighborhood(say, experiencing a poverty rate of 25 percent compared to a rate of 5 percent) raises the chances of downward mobility by 52 percent.

    Only a very small percentage of white children live in high-poverty neighborhoods throughout childhood while a majority of black children do—a pattern that hasn’t changed in thirty years.

    • Over the course of childhood, two out of three black children (66 percent) born from 1985 through 2000 were raised in neighborhoods with at least a 20 percent poverty rate, compared to just 6 percent of white children.
    • Among children born from 1955 through 1970, 62 percent of black children
    were raised in neighborhoods with at least a 20 percent poverty rate, compared to only 4 percent of white children. And, almost half (49 percent) of black children with family income in the top three quintiles lived in high-poverty neighborhoods compared to only one percent of white children.

    Neighborhood poverty explains One-Quarter to One-Third of the black-white gap in downward mobility.

    • Four in five black children who started in the top three quintiles experienced
    downward mobility, compared with just two in five white children. Three in five white children who started in the bottom two quintiles experienced upward mobility, versus just one in four black children.
    • If black and white children had grown up in neighborhoods with similar poverty rates (i.e., if whites had grown up where blacks did or blacks had grown up where whites did), the gap in downward mobility between them would be smaller by one-fourth to one-third.
    • Neighborhood poverty alone accounts for a greater portion of the black-white downward mobility gap than the effects of parental education, occupation, labor force participation, and a range of other family characteristics combined.

    The report’s analysis also suggests that black children who experience a reduction in their neighborhood’s poverty rate have greater economic success in adulthood than black children who experience poverty rates that increase or are stable.

    • Black children who lived in neighborhoods that saw a decline in poverty of
    10 percentage points in the 1980s had annual adult incomes almost $7,000 greater than those who grew up in neighborhoods where the poverty rate was stable.

    Reducing the concentration of poverty in their neighborhoods could strongly impact children’s economic mobility.

    • These data suggest that public policy efforts which focus on investing in disadvantaged neighborhoods and reducing the concentration of poverty could enhance upward economic mobility for the children in such neighborhoods.
    Thoughts?

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  2. #2
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
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    It is my impression (mind you I don't live in the states, I'm basing this on I've heard from people/stereotypes?) that black families are unwilling to move away from their original communities despite knowing the impact of the neighbourhood on their kids. I'm going to assume this is due to social constrains... peer pressure... "what it means to be black" etc etc. Actually it's likely no different than the case for white people... except the initial state for one is high and the other low.

    Reducing the concentration of poverty in their neighborhoods could strongly impact children’s economic mobility.
    Yes this may be true... yet I'm not so sure this is possible to accomplish wide-scale... For most communities, there is heavy resistance towards change, regardless of whether this is change for the better or for the worse. Especially in high poverty communities, I suspect gangs play a huge role in shaping the culture(? not the best word here). Any outside "assistance" will seem like intrusion... attempts to undermine their influence.
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  3. #3

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    Interesting thoughts, nightning.

    I couldn't really speculate on why there is clustering in poverty stricken neighborhoods despite having the incomes to leave. Perhaps home is home, even if you can "make it out." Perhaps there is discrimination from both their would be new neighbors and their would be old neighbirs. IDK.

    But, like you, I also don't like the conclusion drawn in the executive summary. I think a more effective and more acheivable goal would be to reproduce conditions in poor areas that are similar to that of the richer ones...
    1)First and foremost, reduction of violence, gangs, drugs, etc.
    2)Second, the improvement of education (which would be greatly aided by the first goal).
    3)Though perhaps part of the first, creating an environment of trust and cooperation between the local authority and the local populace. More neighborhood watches, volunteer fire departments, plant a tree days, Dream Street initiatives, other neighborhood associations and volunteer organizations. Getting people involved in helping their neighborhoods, could even make the environment more conducive to growth due to having more people involved.

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
    Robot Fusion
    "As our island of knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance." John Wheeler
    "[A] scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Richard Feynman
    "[P]etabytes of [] data is not the same thing as understanding emergent mechanisms and structures." Jim Crutchfield

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    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    I don't trust statistics.

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    Branded with Satan murkrow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    I don't trust statistics.
    Selfish cunts.
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  6. #6
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ygolo View Post
    But, like you, I also don't like the conclusion drawn in the executive summary. I think a more effective and more acheivable goal would be to reproduce conditions in poor areas that are similar to that of the richer ones...
    1)First and foremost, reduction of violence, gangs, drugs, etc.
    2)Second, the improvement of education (which would be greatly aided by the first goal).
    3)Though perhaps part of the first, creating an environment of trust and cooperation between the local authority and the local populace. More neighborhood watches, volunteer fire departments, plant a tree days, Dream Street initiatives, other neighborhood associations and volunteer organizations. Getting people involved in helping their neighborhoods, could even make the environment more conducive to growth due to having more people involved.
    *nods* And inside out movement will work far better than a heavy handed top down approach implied by the authors.

    Here lies the question: how? How do we get the communities to see that change is possible and necessary? City budgets do not allow for such spendings. With the current economy, states are unlikely to provide assistance. So it must be up to the people within the community to start this process. Who's going to encourage them to take that first step?

    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    I don't trust statistics.
    Mistrust due to ignorance is nothing to be proud of. Perhaps a lesson or two on the basic principles of statistics will help? There'll be no math involved I promised.
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    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    My family moved from the straight up ghetto when I was 10 and into a working/middle class predominantly black neighborhood. I'm positive that had we stayed where we were none of us would have gone to college and I'd probably be on my third kid by now.

    Reasons that I can think of for not moving:
    • The transition to being one of "The Only" or "The Few" and the stunning adjustment issues that surround that
    • The belief that there's a low chance of acceptance/integration in a higher income neighborhood
    • Family still living in the area may prevent mobility
    • Moving into a "better" neighborhood means moving further out from the city, which typically means a longer and more costly commute
    • Allegiance to the black community for identity purposes. I've known so many black people who said they wished they'd grown up around more black people. This ties in with the first possible reason.


    When I first went to college, adjusting from a predominantly black environment to one where I was one of less than 100 black students and a 2000+ person college was like culture shock to me.
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    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightning View Post
    Mistrust due to ignorance is nothing to be proud of. Perhaps a lesson or two on the basic principles of statistics will help? There'll be no math involved I promised.
    I hope to god that this response is a joke.

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    I am Sofa King!!! kendoiwan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    When I first went to college, adjusting from a predominantly black environment to one where I was one of less than 100 black students and a 2000+ person college was like culture shock to me.
    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...ml#post1161526

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    (☞゚∀゚)☞ The Decline's Avatar
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    I highly recommend this book on the issue:

    The hidden cost of being African ... - Google Books

    This book (which won many sociologically-related awards) details the differences between black and white mobility. The author was motivated through seeing his black peer struggle with mobility and wealth, even though in university and careers they both succeeded equally well. It argues that black impoverishment is a legacy of discrimination that continues today, even in a less-racist environment.
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