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Thread: Libertarians?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    The question was whether or not libertarians are on this site... and it seems as if you disagree with it in theory, since it has yet to be executed in practice.
    I meant I respect it as a theory. I disagree with it because there is not enough welfare. If I had no money I wouldn't think about starting a business but about what I will eat.
    I think everyone needs to receive welfare.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by hommefatal View Post
    I meant I respect it as a theory. I disagree with it because there is not enough welfare. If I had no money I wouldn't think about starting a business but about what I will eat.
    I think everyone needs to receive welfare.
    It depends on the terms of the welfare. I live in a place where grandmothers, mothers and children are receiving welfare in the same household - it's generational. Those kids will grow up expecting handouts, too. There is no incentive to work. I am against state welfare but have accepted it as part of our society. But do you honestly think there should be no reasonable limits, more than what we have now? Would you understand and support the concept of workfare instead?

    A woman lives upstairs from me and she has the same exact apartment as me. I pay a lot of money to live there, while she has paid nothing - not one penny - for over 8 years. She just keeps having children by a multitude of different fathers. She drives a Benz.

    What system do you think can prevent this level of abuse? Because I would just yank it away...

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluffywolf View Post
    I'm no libertarian... Not in this world, I'm not. I don't have the amount of faith in humanity that is required to be a libertarian and realistically support what it stands for.
    I have no faith in humanity either, which is why I don't want them to rule over me and lead me.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    I have no faith in humanity either, which is why I don't want them to rule over me and lead me.
    A fully blown libertarian world would only cause more grief. Humanity isn't capable of dealing with such freedom. It needs to be controlled.
    ~Self-depricating Megalomaniacal Superwolf

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluffywolf View Post
    A fully blown libertarian world would only cause more grief. Humanity isn't capable of dealing with such freedom. It needs to be controlled.
    You sound scary. But "hot" scary. Damn.

    Anyway, back to the point. Libertarians are not lawless, we just believe in smaller government. I think everyone really has the wrong idea. We are not anarchists.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    It depends on the terms of the welfare. I live in a place where grandmothers, mothers and children are receiving welfare in the same household - it's generational. Those kids will grow up expecting handouts, too. There is no incentive to work. I am against state welfare but have accepted it as part of our society. But do you honestly think there should be no reasonable limits, more than what we have now? Would you understand and support the concept of workfare instead?

    A woman lives upstairs from me and she has the same exact apartment as me. I pay a lot of money to live there, while she has paid nothing - not one penny - for over 8 years. She just keeps having children by a multitude of different fathers. She drives a Benz.

    What system do you think can prevent this level of abuse? Because I would just yank it away...
    I completely understand your objection. I like the German system. Everyone receives basic welfare. It's enough to survive but it's not enough to buy luxury things. So everyone will want to work and those who don't aren't able anyway.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenocyde View Post
    You sound scary. But "hot" scary. Damn.

    Anyway, back to the point. Libertarians are not lawless, we just believe in smaller government. I think everyone really has the wrong idea. We are not anarchists.
    I think there's no big difference in practicability.

  8. #28
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    With the amount of corruption in the world today, my personal opinion would be more control and more governmential influence. And a more direct influence on who governs what. As well as a better system for making the descisions that need to be made. Seems in order.

    Take away as much influence as possible, and the corruption would only grow. Criminal orginisations would flourish and grow out of control. And no amount of law would be able to prevent that. Unless you can promise that all the people running the law are all in fact just and unbiased. But you can't. There will be corruption there as well.

    The world would be divided between those who abuse, and those who are abused.

    Yeah, I have a pretty extreme black and white view on it. But should the world become libertarian and this is what happens. I'll be the first to say "I told you so.".
    ~Self-depricating Megalomaniacal Superwolf

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by hommefatal View Post
    I completely understand your objection. I like the German system. Everyone receives basic welfare. It's enough to survive but it's not enough to buy luxury things. So everyone will want to work and those who don't aren't able anyway.
    I lived in Germany for quite a few years and I hated the system. The level of taxes were outrageous. No one worked because there was no incentive to do so. People sat around in coffee shops all day long complaining about how there are no jobs, while I worked and made my living. This was the main reason why I left Berlin... just the lack of motivation from people was discouraging.

    I just don't find the idea of working my ass off to support others to be such a great system. Hmm, different value systems, I guess.

    Quote Originally Posted by hommefatal View Post
    I think there's no big difference in practicability.
    I don't understand what you mean, but I don't really care to have the explanation, either.

  10. #30
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluffywolf View Post
    The world would be divided between those who abuse, and those who are abused.
    It already is.

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