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Thread: On democracy

  1. #31
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by murkrow View Post
    I wish there were some monarchies worth living in.
    Well, in 1999 we had a referendum to ask whether we wanted to remain a monarchy, and the answer was a resounding, "Yes", from all of Oz except for one small territory.

    Also we have an excellent immigration program, including a refugee program, and you might be surprised to learn that we even take people from Canada.

    So Murkrow, you would be most welcome to join us.

    We are truly happy campers in our antipodean monarchy.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    When required, I managed to find appointments with my deputies, my mayors, and even had interviews with my ministers. It's not easy, it's not simple, but everybody can do it if you represent a cause greater than yourself.
    It can be long and disappointing, but those who try nothing, gain nothing.

    So I ask again: have you even tried?
    I'm not sure if you have really understood what a modern democracy is, and especially how decisions are taken.
    Here we live in a representative democracy and I have been surprised and pleased at how much power my local member of parliament has.

    Of course it does require time to approach them and present coherent proposals to them. But once they are onside and understand the problem, they can be very effective.

    Unfortunately most of us do not appreciate just how much power their local democratic representative has, and so prefer to complain rather than take constructive action.

    So it would be fair to say that our representative democracy is better than we deserve.

  3. #33
    Senior Member Feops's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    Long story short:

    Democracy is only an illusion. Everyone knows that the people never have a say in anything important. Not even during revolutions. It is only the leaders - corporate, religious, political etc - that rules.

    Why bother? In practice, the entire "free world" is using the good old Athenian style democracy, even if we think we're not. Most people are still slaves, and to think differently is indeed stupid. Kudos to you if you are not a slave under the economy and politics of your country. It probably means that you could be considered a criminal, or another kind of persona non grata.

    Thoughts? Counter-points? Don't give me any of that idealistic libertarian/republican/democratic/leftist bullshit. Realistic, please.
    I think this was a rather elaborate way of shouting out "YOU ARE ALL SHEEP", which some people seem keen to do now and then, for reasons I've yet to discover.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    Liberal democracy certainly is bullshit.
    The genius of liberal democracy is the limitation of power.

    Just consider, the intuitive aim of any politician is to increase their power.

    But the genius of liberal democracy is the counter-intuitive limitation of power.

    So liberal democracy transcends the desires of politicians, and of course despots.

    Liberal democracy addresses the problem of power presented by Lord Acton, when he observed that, "Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely".

    And all of this only opens the next important question, and that is, how did we end up with liberal democracy in the indisputable face of power?

    An interesting question.

  5. #35
    Branded with Satan murkrow's Avatar
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    What a fool I am to value a system that I do not contribute to and do not appreciate the results of so low!

    How dare I use the tool of showing my preference for a political structure employed in stories when expressing my distaste?!

    Truly, your wisdom is ever confounding to the base ideas of my simple mind.

    Victor, the lover of mankind.
    wails from the crypt.

  6. #36
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    Can't you see that they (China) will be the dominating superpower within a few decades?
    I seriously doubt this. It's not too difficult to reduce poverty when your average citizen is ridiculously poor. But to improve their standard of living to the point where they are a dominating superpower is different ballgame. I wouldn't be so quick to jump on that bandwagon.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  7. #37
    The Unwieldy Clawed One Falcarius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    I seriously doubt this. It's not too difficult to reduce poverty when your average citizen is ridiculously poor. But to improve their standard of living to the point where they are a dominating superpower is different ballgame. I wouldn't be so quick to jump on that bandwagon.
    What has being a ''dominating superpower'' got to do with the standard of living in a country?
    Quote Originally Posted by Thalassa View Post
    Oh our 3rd person reference to ourselves denotes nothing more than we realize we are epic characters on the forum.

    Narcissism, plain and simple.

  8. #38
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    Liberal democracy certainly is bullshit. I support the kind of democracy the Swiss have, which is more direct and locally based.
    Switzerland is a liberal democracy. And with the direct democracy aspect to their government, they have even more of that "tyranny of the majority" you claim to be against.

  9. #39
    Courage is immortality Valiant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    Switzerland is a liberal democracy. And with the direct democracy aspect to their government, they have even more of that "tyranny of the majority" you claim to be against.
    I think Peguy meant that the central government does not interfere as much, leaving the locals to decide local matters...

    Mightier than the tread of marching armies is the power of an idea whose time has come

  10. #40
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    It will be impossible for a non-democratic regime to be the hegemonic leader of the free world.

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