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  1. #221
    Senior Member dga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beat View Post
    Obviously, I'm not talking of heavy drugs as used for medicinal purposes in a controlled manner. I'm talking of walking into a drug store and buying heroin because I want to get high.


    You serious? Moral decency and religion aren't one in the same. A few examples: Sex in public is against the law. In a store with explicit magazines (minus adult stores where you must be carded to enter) it is law to have the black plastic sheet over the covers where young wondering eyes won't see. I could come up with dozens more if I wanted to take the time, but I think you get my point. Some things are deemed indecent in American society. Condonement for abuse of toxic/addictive substances is one of them.

    This debate is going in circles at this point, so I'm gonna chime out now.

    The US stance is simply wrong. Censored body parts on magazine covers? The taliban would be proud. Sex is actually legal in a particular amsterdam park. Nudity is allowed in german advertising. As stated, drug related violence in portugal is down since ending prohibition. Legal rights for gay and lesbian relationships is quite standard through much of europe, and the sky is not falling down here yet.

    It would be a fallacy to hold up american society as a model of moral or logical superiority. The american divorce rate is over 50 percent, it has one ofhte highest incarceration rates in the world, yet some get hung up on whether their neighbor lets loose in his own privacy.

    It is a fallacy to declare that users take drugs to escape or whatever position lets otehrs feel better about themselves. I get high cuz i like to, but i also stay sober because getting high doesnt make many of the things i need ot do any more fun or productive. The balance is up to any user to decide, just like eating or watching television.

  2. #222
    Senior Member swordpath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dga View Post
    The balance is up to any user to decide, just like eating or watching television.
    Since when have you seen an addict use "balance"? That's the problem, besides controlled medicinal situations; heavy drugs are good for nothing but addiction. Some people will lightly experiment and escape unscathed, big whoop. Addiction is very real and too much of a risk. It's all about weighing the pros and the cons of the situation. The government doesn't give a damn if you had a good time at the party. It is however taxed when it has to pick bodies up off the street, answer calls of people being delirious and out of their mind and causing problems and treating people for medical problems tied to drug usage and addiction.

    The only people I see that are adamant on legalization are the ones that want to use. If someone wants something, they'll find any reasoning and justifcation they can contrive to make a point. It's not even rational. For your ordinary, non drug using citizen, I highly doubt you're going to hear them complaining about the police still making drug arrests, despite the fact that it costs money. Want to talk conservation of money? How about all the other BS programs out their that are draining our tax dollars?

  3. #223
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beat View Post
    The only people I see that are adamant on legalization are the ones that want to use.
    You're either a liar or you're blind.

    LEAP - Law Enforcement Against Prohibition - Cops Say Legalize Drugs
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  4. #224
    Senior Member swordpath's Avatar
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    Maybe those cops are jonesin for a doobie...

    Not but really, most often, especially in this thread, that's the way it seems. I think by majority I'm correct as well.

  5. #225
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beat View Post
    Maybe those cops are jonesin for a doobie...

    Not but really, most often, especially in this thread, that's the way it seems. I think by majority I'm correct as well.
    You're trying to make the anti-prohibition stance illegitimate by using personal attacks.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  6. #226
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beat View Post
    Maybe those cops are jonesin for a doobie...

    Not but really, most often, especially in this thread, that's the way it seems. I think by majority I'm correct as well.
    No, you are not. I tried almost every drug there is to do, and I keep myself to my red wine or Belgian beer and the occasional pack of Camel Lights. You don't have a leg to stand on here.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  7. #227
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beat View Post
    The only people I see that are adamant on legalization are the ones that want to use. If someone wants something, they'll find any reasoning and justifcation they can contrive to make a point. It's not even rational.
    I have noticed that users are in favour of legalisation.

  8. #228
    Once Was Synarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    I have noticed that users are in favour of legalisation.
    +1

    And, I have family members with addiction problems, so I'm pretty full-up with all the bullshit about how harmless it is.
    "Create like a god, command like a king, work like a slave."

  9. #229
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    ^ that's the thing exactly imo. I wouldn't care if an adult smokes pot on the weekends. but drugs are progressive habits, and they destroy people's lives and families. It's a selfish addiction by the whole of it. Just like people are selfish with alcohol, so too are they with drugs.

    America cannot be held to the same standards as Europe because the people are different themselves. We're lazy, and selfish, and me-centered. Not to say Europeans can't be that way, but Americans have that reputation for a damn good reason: It's pretty much true when you look at the masses. I don't know how many friends of mine chose "beer" over "rent". And that's just the legal one.

    No one can control how much alcohol someone buys.. What makes anyone think the amount of drugs will be controled and well maintained when it becomes legal? Kids will have just as much access to adult decisions as alcohol not to mention.
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  10. #230
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    No one can control how much alcohol someone buys.. What makes anyone think the amount of drugs will be controled and well maintained when it becomes legal?
    Who controls it now?

    Kids will have just as much access to adult decisions as alcohol not to mention.
    I guess it's a good thing dealers don't sell drugs to kids anymore.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

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