User Tag List

12311 Last

Results 1 to 10 of 130

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    MBTI
    INxJ
    Posts
    3,917

    Default Lying For The Lord

    It's a Mormon thing. It's called Lying for the Lord. And it's a tenet of the Mormon faith that, Mormons think, gives them to the right to tell you a bald-faced lie, so long as it's a lie that somehow furthers the Mormon cause.

    What else to call the Mormon's laughable statement today that their posthumous baptism last year of President Obama's mother was a "rare" mistake that might have been done by "pranksters."

    Yes, we're to believe that the Mormons, just by coincidence, forcibly converted a presidential candidate's deceased mother, 13 years after her death, and only months before the presidential election. And we're also to believe no warning bells went off at Mormon Central when they saw that the woman's husband, whose name is clearly listed on her "baptismal record," is "Barack Hussein Obama." (Obama's father has the same name.) Yes, all one big unfortunate "rare" mistake. Kind of like a clerical error. Except instead of giving you the wrong change, they just stole your mother's soul.

    The Mormons would have you believe that this kind of thing - forcibly converting the dead of other faiths to Mormonism, without their families' permission - is something that only happens once in a blue moon. Tell that to the families of Holocaust victims who have been trying to get the Mormons to stop baptizing their dead for over a decade. The Mormons even promised to stop forcibly converting Jewish Holocaust victims, back in 1995, only for it to be revealed a few months ago that - surprise! - they didn't really stop.

    It's ghoulish to be sure, but it's neither rare nor a mistake. It's what the Mormons do. And when they get caught, they lie about it, just as they're lying to our President today, and just as they've been lying to the Jews for over a decade.

    Why does this matter? Because the Mormons are "the" bankers of the religious right. Last fall, the Mormons dropped $20 million into California and singlehandedly turned a losing battle into the successful repeal of marriage rights for gay couples in that state. The Mormons have bankrolled hate initiatives in Alaska and Hawaii and across the northwest and midwest for the past decade. They are not some fringe "religion" to be shrugged off. The new anti-gay marriage coalition, National Organization for Marriage, keeps finding, seemingly out of nowhere, $1.5m for this ad campaign, then another $1.5m for that ad campaign. Where are they finding this sudden infusion of cash? Inquiring minds want to know.

    The fact that the Mormons chose to forcibly convert the deceased mother of the President of the United States, only months before he was elected to office, is relevant to our discussion of the Mormon influence in American politics today. There is a larger pattern of bigotry that should concern us all. Has anyone noticed how all of their victims are minorities? The mother of a black president. The forced conversion of Jewish Holocaust victims. The history of racial animus towards African-Americans (and blacks more generally). And now the financing of religious right anti-gay hate.

    Every one a minority. I'm sure it's just another rare mistake.

    If the Mormons want to promote hate back in their own state, that's their affair. When they export it to the world, steal our dead, and try to weasel their way into the Obama administration by pushing for a place at the table overseeing the Faith Based Initiative, among other ventures, it's all of our business.

    AMERICAblog News| A great nation deserves the truth: Lying for the Lord
    Mormons baptized without permission, 380,000 dead Jews of the Holocaust. The Mormon grandson(?) of one of the current Mormon apostles was on the NOM board of directors until recently.

  2. #2
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    8,193

    Default

    This may be insensitive, but I really don't see the issue here. Does an atheist get insulted when a Christian tells him to go to hell? This, to me, is the equivalent of someone tapping me on the shoulder and saying "You're it lol" when I'm not even playing the game.

    The part of your article I find most interesting, however, is the apparent financial strength and power of the Mormon church and how that affects its ability to direct legislation.



  3. #3
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    MBTI
    ESFJ
    Posts
    6,946

    Default

    Symbolically, that's somewhat offensive. In practice, who really gives a fuck?
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    MBTI
    INxJ
    Posts
    3,917

    Default

    It seems to matter to the relatives of the deceased.

    The Jews died for their religious beliefs. It's condescending and disrespectful for Mormons to just adopt Jews and claim them as their own. Especially considering, Mormon beliefs are in direct conflict with Judaism. You know zombie Jesus, Mormons becoming gods themselves in the afterlife, and receiving their own planets after death.

    Holocaust Jews should be off limits for obvious reasons.

  5. #5
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    FREE
    Enneagram
    594 sx/sp
    Socionics
    LII Ne
    Posts
    42,333

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by 01011010 View Post
    It seems to matter to the relatives of the deceased. The Jews died for their religious beliefs. It's condescending and disrespectful for Mormons to just adopt Jews and claim them as their own. Especially considering, Mormon beliefs are in direct conflict with Judaism. You know zombie Jesus, Mormons becoming gods themselves in the afterlife, and receiving their own planets after death. Holocaust Jews should be off limits for obvious reasons.
    I guess it's sort of offensive.

    But there's not a lot of difference between that and praying for someone else who doesn't share your religious beliefs -- you're still assuming you're right and you're trying to pray your reality over someone else who might or might not agree. Should that be off-limits too or considered morally offensive? This Mormon thing is just an extreme example of that mentality.

    Personally I am more apt to find it stupid than offensive. In reality, all they're getting for their efforts is a lot of wasted time and water, since it's all just empty ritual... and if it's not, shouldn't we be thanking them for saving so many people (even against their will, while steeped in their iniquities)?

    Meanwhile, I'm more concerned about the money they dump into social causes I don't particularly care for.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  6. #6
    Was E.laur Laurie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    7w6
    Socionics
    ENFp
    Posts
    6,075

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by 01011010 View Post
    Mormons baptized without permission, 380,000 dead Jews of the Holocaust as well. Actually, the Mormon grandson of one of the current Mormon apostles was on the NOM board of directors until recently.
    Eh, they didn't actually baptize anyone, did they? They just said something with the names?

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    MBTI
    INxJ
    Posts
    3,917

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    I guess it's sort of offensive.

    But there's not a lot of difference between that and praying for someone else who doesn't share your religious beliefs -- you're still assuming you're right and you're trying to pray your reality over someone else who might or might not agree. Should that be off-limits too or considered morally offensive? This Mormon thing is just an extreme example of that mentality.

    Personally I am more apt to find it stupid than offensive. In reality, all they're getting for their efforts is a lot of wasted time and water, since it's all just empty ritual... and if it's not, shouldn't we be thanking them for saving so many people (even against their will, while steeped in their iniquities)?

    Meanwhile, I'm more concerned about the money they dump into social causes I don't particularly care for.
    Actually, you make a really good point.

    Nonetheless, converting deceased individuals' religions without consent does cross moral lines. Religions are concerned with the soul, right? Does it matter that the body isn't there? There's a reason LDS and a handful of smaller cults are the only ones that currently practice baptism of the dead.

    To be honest, I'm kind of glad they "accidentally" baptized Obama's Catholic mother and performed a creepy endowment (ritual temple act very similar to Freemasonry) ceremony on her a week later. Maybe this will provide more national coverage, to expose how the Mormon Church operates on many levels.


    Quote Originally Posted by Elaur View Post
    Eh, they didn't actually baptize anyone, did they? They just said something with the names?
    The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

    In the practice of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (or "Mormons"), a living person, acting as proxy, is baptized by immersion on behalf of a deceased person of the same gender. The baptism ritual is as follows: after calling the living proxy by name, the person performing the baptism says, "Having been commissioned of Jesus Christ, I baptize you for and in behalf of [full name of deceased person], who is dead, in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen." The proxy is then immersed briefly in the water. This is almost identical to the way Baptism is performed for living individuals (with slight variation in the wording).

    Baptism for the dead - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

  8. #8
    I'm a star. Kangirl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    MBTI
    ENTJ
    Posts
    1,470

    Default

    My personal take on this is that it's pretty offensive. Retchworthily so.
    "Only an irrational dumbass, would burn Jews." - Jaguar

    "please give concise answers in plain English" - request from Provoker

  9. #9
    Was E.laur Laurie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    7w6
    Socionics
    ENFp
    Posts
    6,075

    Default

    Well I mean physically. It's rather bizarre and who knows why they do it, but nothing actually happens to the person except their name being quoted.

    That really is strange.

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    MBTI
    INxJ
    Posts
    3,917

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Elaur View Post
    Well I mean physically. It's rather bizarre and who knows why they do it, but nothing actually happens to the person except their name being quoted.

    That really is strange.
    Do you think they would dig up corpses for baptism? That would be extremely creepy. It's illegal to mess with Jewish gravesites in Germany.

Similar Threads

  1. Who is responsible for the lies of our leaders?
    By Octarine in forum Politics, History, and Current Events
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 09-19-2011, 10:07 AM
  2. One for the experts.
    By Xander in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 07-03-2008, 05:29 PM
  3. [MBTItm] A Question For The Domiant Type At This Forum?
    By "?" in forum The SP Arthouse (ESFP, ISFP, ESTP, ISTP)
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 06-03-2007, 10:55 AM
  4. [INFJ] sympathy for the despicable
    By Eileen in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 51
    Last Post: 06-02-2007, 06:38 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO