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  1. #61
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelric View Post
    and like you say, *somebody* pays for the care that is delivered (although I don't for a minute accept that everyone without medical care actually gets to and receives care in emergency rooms). ?

    You should. It's the law. In fact, pregnant Mexicans in border towns have been jumping for decades, because 1) American hospitals can't turn away women in labor; and 2) children born on American soil are American citizens, automatically.
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  2. #62
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    maliafee, are you under the impression that the Republican party opposes social programs? The amount of spending on federal social programs skyrocketed under Republican control of the government. If you believe that the Republicans that have actually been in power (not some dude ranting at an NRA meeting) are in favor of eliminating federal social programs, then you are falling for some tired rhetoric from the Democratic party or left-wing groups. The national Republican party gave up the idea of reducing federal power a long time ago. Bob Dole was the last Republican nominee for president that actually dared to put forth the radical notion that the federal government's purpose is not to be Santa Claus, handing out gifts to people, and he got called a mean old rich man for doing so. Bush and McCain both ran on tickets of EXPANDING federal control over a whole host of things. To paint the Republican party as an instrument for ripping up social "safety nets", you'd have to be listening to some very distorted propaganda or simply not paying much attention.
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  3. #63
    Feline Member kelric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    You should. It's the law. In fact, pregnant Mexicans in border towns have been jumping for decades, because 1) American hospitals can't turn away women in labor; and 2) children born on American soil are American citizens, automatically.
    I wasn't talking about people showing up and not being treated - I was talking about things like people having (potentially preventable) heart attacks, strokes, etc. and never making it there (dying en route or in their sleep, etc.), or using the fact that they don't have insurance as a reason to not go to the emergency room due to embarrassment, etc. I'm sure it happens... and I'd bet it happens a lot.
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  4. #64
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    Jeff, I think that was part of Malia's point: "Why would someone call himself a Republican when he knows that Republican politicians do what you just described?"
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  5. #65
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelric View Post
    I wasn't talking about people showing up and not being treated - I was talking about things like people having (potentially preventable) heart attacks, strokes, etc. and never making it there (dying en route or in their sleep, etc.), or using the fact that they don't have insurance as a reason to not go to the emergency room due to embarrassment, etc. I'm sure it happens... and I'd bet it happens a lot.

    Who the hell would avoid going to the emergency room because they don't have insurance? That is insane.
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  6. #66
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cimarron View Post
    Jeff, I think that was part of Malia's point: "Why would someone call himself a Republican when he knows that Republican politicians do what you just described?"
    But Malia said she's in FAVOR of federal government expansion.
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  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelric View Post
    I wasn't talking about people showing up and not being treated - I was talking about things like people having (potentially preventable) heart attacks, strokes, etc. and never making it there (dying en route or in their sleep, etc.), or using the fact that they don't have insurance as a reason to not go to the emergency room due to embarrassment, etc. I'm sure it happens... and I'd bet it happens a lot.
    We can't prevent everyone in the country from facing illness and dying :/. Consider what is reasonable, realistic, and affordable in a sustainable manner. If they don't go to the emergency room because of embarrassment, whose fault is that? YOU DESERVE TO DIE if you don't go to the emergency room because you don't have insurance or are too embarrassed, because you obviously can't make the simple calculation that going means you'll stay alive and not going means you'll die. Everyone can get emergency treatment, but good lord, not everyone in the country can claim the right to get every bit life extending procedure they can possibly get.

    Jeez, I wonder how conflicted the liberal eugenicists are on this issue...

  8. #68
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    We can't prevent everyone in the country from facing illness and dying :/. Consider what is reasonable, realistic, and affordable in a sustainable manner. If they don't go to the emergency room because of embarrassment, whose fault is that? YOU DESERVE TO DIE if you don't go to the emergency room because you don't have insurance or are too embarrassed, because you obviously can't make the simple calculation that going means you'll stay alive and not going means you'll die. Everyone can get emergency treatment, but good lord, not everyone in the country can claim the right to get every bit life extending procedure they can possibly get.

    Jeez, I wonder how conflicted the liberal eugenicists are on this issue...
    We don't need to be calling anyone "eugenicists." It's not as if Margaret Sanger is posting on here.
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  9. #69
    Furry Critter with Claws Kiddo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    It's inarguable because history has proven it. You'd be arguing against historical reality. It has nothing to do with dogma. It's readily apparent to anyone who looks at the world with an open mind. You've seen the facts and figures, but they don't correspond to your ideology, so, CLEARLY, they cannot be right.
    Show don't tell.

    If history so clearly proves it, then you should be able to demonstrate it with examples. So far you haven't provided any substantiated evidence to back up this "inarguable" idea. Of course I can't argue against that of which you don't provide any evidence.
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  10. #70
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Show don't tell.

    If history so clearly proves it, then you should be able to demonstrate it with examples. So far you haven't provided any substantiated evidence to back up this "inarguable" idea. Of course I can't argue against that of which you don't provide any evidence.

    Even if it were possible to prove it mathematically, you still wouldn't pay heed. But, since I have some numbers handy, take a look at these.


    http://web.econ.ohio-state.edu/rstec...dia---2002.pdf

    The only countries with a demonstrably greater increase in standard of living are Japan (which had no heavy industry at all in the early-1800s). The U.S. is comparable with Norway and Finland, two very dynamic economies who grew immensely post-WWII. The rate of increase is almost twice that of the Netherlands and the UK, and several times higher than those of Mexico, Africa, and the rest of the developing world.
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