User Tag List

First 202829303132 Last

Results 291 to 300 of 375

  1. #291
    half mystic, half skeksis jenocyde's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w8
    Socionics
    ENTp
    Posts
    6,387

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    You misjudged me. It is my fault.
    There is a lot of truth in what you say.
    It is not about agreement or disagreement.

    If a doctor gives you pot or speed, it is all right.
    Buy it on the street, you might spend your life in jail.

    I do not get it.
    Do you get it?
    How it is possible things get out of hand so bad?

    An aristocratic cynic says: It is the price of democracy. Plain and simple.
    Idiots come first.

    An error in logic.
    Truth does not side.
    I don't get it either. This country has a very skewed way of dealing with problems. But I can say that most things we are doing now are just not working. As I stated before, Republicans demonize personal freedoms - making victimless "crimes" punishable, leaving all those children without fathers, and then getting upset when we have to help the mothers financially. Democrats demonize personal responsibility - making it seem like anyone who asks for anything should automatically get it with no strings attached. Of course, this is a very simplistic view of my humble opinion but you get the point.

    Democracy: 2 wolves and a sheep voting on what to eat for dinner. But we're a republic anyway, not a democracy, thank goodness!

  2. #292
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    MBTI
    ISTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/so
    Posts
    3,424

    Default

    So Malia, is uh...any of this giving you a better picture of how a Republican might (not necessarily so, but possibly might) be a good person? The thrust of this thread is not very sharp.
    You can't spell "justice" without ISTJ.

  3. #293
    Senior Member mlittrell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    9w1
    Posts
    1,387

    Default

    i think the ideas of parties is stupid...there is no way a single party is going to believe exactly what i believe
    "Honest differences are often a healthy sign of progress. "

    "You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty."

    "An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind."

    Mahatma Gandhi

    Enneagram: 9w1

  4. #294
    Senior Member cogdecree's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    MBTI
    ISTJ
    Enneagram
    165
    Posts
    248

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Babylon Candle View Post
    im gonna really mess this thread up, but here it goes:

    you know what else coincides with the drug war and decrease in violent crime? all the kids that werent born due to "roe v wade". ie, the age that those kids would have been 15 is when the numbers start to drop. ie they werent around to be raised by disinterested parents... (im not the first to suggest this, i think freakonomics talks about it, though i havent read it)
    that would be interesting if this is the case

  5. #295
    Senior Member cogdecree's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    MBTI
    ISTJ
    Enneagram
    165
    Posts
    248

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    All drugs.
    alright


    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    You mean, what would stop people from doing more drugs? They'd be legal and available by prescription. It wouldn't get people off drugs, but no one would be killed over them, either. And the price would certainly fall, so people might be able to maintain better. Work would be easier to find, too.
    Not from doing more, from doing the same amount as is now


    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Nothing will stop drug use. That is certain. If we know that much, though, why cause all the misery that our Drug War has? They've decriminalized pretty much everything in Portugal, and their rates of use have stayed steady, but infections and deaths due to hard drug use have fallen dramatically, and they are obviously spending less tax money on prosecutions. Their society is functioning perfectly well.
    I'm not sure on the status of drug laws in Russia, in the 90's, though I know at this time, enforcement would be low, but I know drugs and drug usage is Russia's #1 problem spreading around aides, which is currently at 1.8%.

    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Your statistics are wrong. Violent crime rates went up significantly in the 1980s and peaked around 1989-1991, then fell. They also went back up in the 2000s, now are starting to fall again. Violent crime is higher now than it was in the early-1960s, before the Drug War. Violent crime increased during Prohibition, and it increased in the '80s when they stepped up the Drug War and sentencing for offenders (also crack brought in a lot of new, poor drug abusers in inner cities).
    With the initiation of any stricter laws crime goes up, then goes down, the rates raised high above what it was in the 60's before the drug laws were passed. 91 didn't have a rise that went above what it was since drug laws come into existence. Also you did not consider the riots of 91 raising such, which isn't drug related.

    Also I am not aware of any significant rise in the 2000's, nothing goes perfectly down, but I believe violent crime in the 2000 is still lower than the 90's and 80's.


    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    But it's not just drugs. It's murder, corruption, border jumping, prostitution, beatings, overdoses, infections, and stealing to get money for a fix. It's a blight that is directly correlated to illegality.
    Prostitution would probably increase if we didn't make this legal as well, as this would be the new vice, increasing trafficking, border jumping, beatings, and again overdosing, (many are held to their positions due to addiction).

    Crime won't cease, other means will be found, I am sure of that.


    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Fair enough.
    I'm giving you a hard time; I just want you to lay down some foundation. Or give out some obstacle.

  6. #296
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Posts
    4,474

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    Of course they do. Minorities tend to be poorer, as well.
    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Now, I may get pilloried for even asking this... but is it even remotely possible that minorities in the US actually commit more drug crimes than other groups do?
    Statistics:
    Office of National Drug Control Policy - Minorities & Drugs
    Results from the 2004 National Survey on Drug Use and Health, SAMHSA's Office of Applied Studies
    Quote Originally Posted by cogdecree View Post
    1p) Deficit spending is what increased gains in the US not government involvement.
    o_O
    In reality the new deal was hurting America, WW2 and the selling of weapons is what got America out of the depression (combined with deficit spending). And the Great Depression wasn't felt till after 1930 (crashed in 29), our range we were discussing was 1870-1930. All other depressions were minor hiccups.
    I was referring to The Long Depression. You can see the recessions during the period here too. I count 5, although they none were seriously substantial, and all have different ramifications and causes. It's just ironic that this was the period being talked about, to me - I would of chosen an earlier time, but that wouldn't of coincided with the industrial expansion. Eh, I should of mentioned the Robber Barons and how government needed to intervene in their illegal behaviors.

    4p) Deficit spending. Also in your rebuttal, the basic concept of how it works and how it is exploited is correct, perhaps you should explain what we are missing.
    If this is referring to the NY state handouts, what is missing is evidence that this is feasible.

    I've also heard similar stories here in Canada/BC, which tends to be a lot more welfare based than the US. After a lot of digging, it ended up being an urban myth. It does, of course, have an influence - it shifts the curve around some. But it's not this huge incentive... There were nearly no situations, outside of some very specific minority benefits (aboriginals in Canada's case), where the situation described happened - the system didn't support it.

    Perhaps you should explain to me how democrats are for smaller government.
    Historical spending pattern.

    But also note I didn't say that democrats were for smaller government: I said neither party was for smaller government. But relative to each other, democrats are more small government... and even if that's not significant, they are notably more responsible spenders.

    6p) I still don't get how we are identical, you can argue multiple sides but how is it the same? Is communism and capitalism on the same coin during the Cold War? I also would like an explanation of how this works (not on my lame analogy but about the ideologies within the us)
    I didn't put it very well - I meant that people choose them on ideology and not on performance or actual behavior... and as a result, the actual differences between the operation of the groups are very minor relative to their espoused ideology.

    7p) I call complete shenanigans here, we are also debating what is cost effective, we (both sides) do care about the cost. I can't tell if this is supposed to be a golden mean argument or what.

    I'd also like a definition of enlightened society/progress, and how each can't place or think that on themselves.
    Did republicans, as a whole, care about the costs of... say... Sarbanes Oxley? War on Iraq? Patriot Act?

    Do liberals care about the costs of environmentalism (notable alternative power)? Do they listen to the timeframes for global warming/etc? Reverse discrimination? Political correctness?

    What I am saying is that both sides tend to use ideology as a framework for their decisions and behaviors, not an objective (or semi-objective) stance. It causes huge biases in each group - the whole movement against climate change or the movement for political correctness. And both carries pretty significant costs that don't need to exist the way they do. Climate change can (what is being done here in BC) be dealt with by adding a carbon tax - any income that comes out of that reduces income taxes (personal and corporate). It's more efficient, net, than either one alone. And political correctness is getting in the way of science as much as many of the republican actions have. Progress, but only if it is social progress, in a particular direction.

  7. #297
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    MBTI
    INTP
    Posts
    3,619

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    wildcat, here is an article about the study. Fire away.

    Who Gives and Who Doesn't? - ABC News
    I do not think this is what I read.
    I had another point.
    But all right: This thing appears skewed, too. In another way.

    You take the straight path.
    I circle.
    I am lost.

    If you take the straight path you are not lost?

    Do you really believe you can compare Sioux Falls and San Francisco?
    What fundamentally divides these people is but a party card?

    Sioux Falls. A small religious place. A community centred around the Church.
    They have the bucket going around in the Church you know. Every Sunday.

    You are supposed to insert notes in the bucket through the narrow opening at the top of the thing. It takes some effort. And time. The others see what you are donating!
    It is the purpose of the thing: the others can see and judge.
    You cannot hide.
    You are a public spectacle.

    In San Francisco you are not likely to go to church at all.
    Nobody pulls your leg. No priest twists you round his little finger.

    You live in a small townee. You walk your dog along the paveway. You know everybody.
    Hello Bill. Hi Jane. How'rya. Fine, fine. How's the leg? Fine, fine.
    Forced smiles. Receding steps.

    Beware the night.
    There is a hiss in the woodworks.
    Everybody knows.
    How much you put in that bucket.

  8. #298
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    4,909

    Default

    My most favourite republican - Abe Lincoln...then it all went downhill from there.

    Ron Paul is one I supported in the last election as well (as much as a Canadian CAN support)

  9. #299
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    MBTI
    INTP
    Posts
    3,619

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ygolo View Post
    Everything I've read, says that the claim is true. Where did you learn about the structural error?

    There are two theories I've heard for this:
    1) Repblicans are more likely to give to their churches and christian aid organization abraod, boosting their charity rate.
    2) Because of their belief that individual, and not the government, should be the source of aid, they donate more.

    Even a board for vegitarians (usually associated w/ liberals) has this information on it.
    Lower-income, religious Republicans more likely to give to charity, donate blood - VeggieBoards - Vegetarian Forum
    Straight paths.
    Narrow corners.
    David and Goliath.

    Yes. God favoured David.
    See above.

  10. #300
    Senior Member cogdecree's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    MBTI
    ISTJ
    Enneagram
    165
    Posts
    248

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    o_O
    You can have state dificeit spending without heavy fiscal regulations on the people. I still stand by that claim.


    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    I was referring to The Long Depression. You can see the recessions during the period here too. I count 5, although they none were seriously substantial, and all have different ramifications and causes. It's just ironic that this was the period being talked about, to me - I would of chosen an earlier time, but that wouldn't of coincided with the industrial expansion. Eh, I should of mentioned the Robber Barons and how government needed to intervene in their illegal behaviors.
    It was definately a unique period.



    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    If this is referring to the NY state handouts, what is missing is evidence that this is feasible.

    I've also heard similar stories here in Canada/BC, which tends to be a lot more welfare based than the US. After a lot of digging, it ended up being an urban myth. It does, of course, have an influence - it shifts the curve around some. But it's not this huge incentive... There were nearly no situations, outside of some very specific minority benefits (aboriginals in Canada's case), where the situation described happened - the system didn't support it.
    If that is the case for the US as well, then obvioulsy I may be unaware, through proof of such in Canada doesn't prove such in the US.


    Historical spending pattern.

    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    But also note I didn't say that democrats were for smaller government: I said neither party was for smaller government. But relative to each other, democrats are more small government... and even if that's not significant, they are notably more responsible spenders.
    You connecting spending with government size, (not so say that their isn't any connection), but tax the amount collected from the people say more than what the government spent. Also the cold war has a lot to do with the spending patterns here. Especially with Reagan when he uped the pressure.


    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    I didn't put it very well - I meant that people choose them on ideology and not on performance or actual behavior... and as a result, the actual differences between the operation of the groups are very minor relative to their espoused ideology.
    For the most part I disagree, but I won't press the issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    Did republicans, as a whole, care about the costs of... say... Sarbanes Oxley? War on Iraq? Patriot Act?

    Do liberals care about the costs of environmentalism (notable alternative power)? Do they listen to the timeframes for global warming/etc? Reverse discrimination? Political correctness?

    What I am saying is that both sides tend to use ideology as a framework for their decisions and behaviors, not an objective (or semi-objective) stance. It causes huge biases in each group - the whole movement against climate change or the movement for political correctness. And both carries pretty significant costs that don't need to exist the way they do. Climate change can (what is being done here in BC) be dealt with by adding a carbon tax - any income that comes out of that reduces income taxes (personal and corporate). It's more efficient, net, than either one alone. And political correctness is getting in the way of science as much as many of the republican actions have. Progress, but only if it is social progress, in a particular direction.
    Now your taking this as all spending is bad, thing work on a cost/benefit spectrum, if you believe the benifits outweight the cost, or that the outcome is worth the cost, then the action is taken, not that mistakes haven't been made in our history, but I still stand firm that both sides do care about the costs.

Similar Threads

  1. Why are you here?
    By rhinosaur in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 05-19-2011, 06:08 AM
  2. Religion... why?
    By wyrdsister in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 175
    Last Post: 01-28-2010, 04:31 PM
  3. Why I am here
    By HilbertSpace in forum Welcomes and Introductions
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 04-25-2007, 01:18 AM
  4. Why?
    By SolitaryWalker in forum Welcomes and Introductions
    Replies: 29
    Last Post: 04-24-2007, 06:55 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO