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    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Default Government Corruption-A Reality

    In this thread, I am going to be expressing my views, and my opinion. They will be completely open, and may be even a little disturbing.

    Shall we begin?

    I just finished reading I am the Cheese by Robert Cormier in English class. I can tell you that this book really opened my eyes and took a lot of theories of mine and backed them up. If you haven't read this book, I highly recommend it, it's an easy read, I read it in 3 days without trouble.



    Well, I have to say this is a very progressive and liberal book. Tells the story of how the government was behind murders and plots against a family who had secret information on them..government corruption.

    It's all a metaphor for the lives we live under government. Do we really know who the good guys are? Why the hell are we so naive to think that they are just a bunch of people trying to make our lives safe and happy. Maybe that's true, a little, but there's so much we don't know, and some that we can theorize, to back up the possibility of government corruption. I went over this a little with my 9/11 Conspiracy Theory article.

    The book made me think that there are probably many cases like it in our own country. That the government has probably done hundreds of things, murdered, had certain people silenced, relocated people, and other things to silence people. In the book, it was the case because the family had secret knowledge of government corruption. I'm trying to bring this into reality..maybe there is government corruption, and maybe there are people who know it but are secretly persued by the government and silenced.

    Adam's mental problem and his lack of knowledge, being blind to what was going on, is also a metaphor for us. We seem to think everything's just fine and great. We're so blind! Though we don't know what, we should understand that things aren't always as they seem!

    Read, interpret, post, discuss. Only post here if you're serious about discussing it. If you're going to say that this isn't true or that this isn't a possibility, then please, save your post. I'm trying to bring some understanding and awareness into your lives. Read the book if you haven't, it's a very easy read, but contains a very powerful message, that I think Cormier was trying to get across to us. A lot of people don't see it either, they thinks it's just another crazy idea to write a book about.

    Conclusion
    I Am The Cheese is bleak, cynical and depressing. It teaches you to question reality and to have no faith in authority.

    Good lessons for any young person and also for plenty of naive adults.
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

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    Quote Originally Posted by OneWithSoul View Post
    In this thread, I am going to be expressing my views, and my opinion. They will be completely open, and may be even a little disturbing.

    Shall we begin?

    I just finished reading I am the Cheese by Robert Cormier in English class. I can tell you that this book really opened my eyes and took a lot of theories of mine and backed them up. If you haven't read this book, I highly recommend it, it's an easy read, I read it in 3 days without trouble.


    Well, I have to say this is a very progressive and liberal book. Tells the story of how the government was behind murders and plots against a family who had secret information on them..government corruption.

    It's all a metaphor for the lives we live under government. Do we really know who the good guys are? Why the hell are we so naive to think that they are just a bunch of people trying to make our lives safe and happy. Maybe that's true, a little, but there's so much we don't know, and some that we can theorize, to back up the possibility of government corruption. I went over this a little with my 9/11 Conspiracy Theory article.

    The book made me think that there are probably many cases like it in our own country. That the government has probably done hundreds of things, murdered, had certain people silenced, relocated people, and other things to silence people. In the book, it was the case because the family had secret knowledge of government corruption. I'm trying to bring this into reality..maybe there is government corruption, and maybe there are people who know it but are secretly persued by the government and silenced.

    Adam's mental problem and his lack of knowledge, being blind to what was going on, is also a metaphor for us. We seem to think everything's just fine and great. We're so blind! Though we don't know what, we should understand that things aren't always as they seem!

    Read, interpret, post, discuss. Only post here if you're serious about discussing it. If you're going to say that this isn't true or that this isn't a possibility, then please, save your post. I'm trying to bring some understanding and awareness into your lives. Read the book if you haven't, it's a very easy read, but contains a very powerful message, that I think Cormier was trying to get across to us. A lot of people don't see it either, they thinks it's just another crazy idea to write a book about.
    Man, you'd do better to look at history as a whole to get that sort of info.

    That the government has probably done hundreds of things, murdered, had certain people silenced, relocated people, and other things to silence people.
    I'd say ALL governments have used there power this way for one reason or another. That should be obvious. If you want something REALLY obvious, try looking up the 150,000 political prisoners thrown in jail by the early PROGRESSIVE president Wilson. Anyone who spoke out against WW1 was thrown in jail, and laws were even passed that attempted to keep people from speaking against the government and the war, even in their own homes. Wilson was a power hungry type of bastard, based on his own words.

    Obviously, our government has done many bad things through different administrations. History books are your friends. The government today is out of control. The government today has no virtues and no sense of logical direction. They are unaccountable to anyone because we let it become this way. The apathetic public, you and I, have allowed the government to slip away from us and accepted it into the culture that politicians should be exalted and live in physical and mental bubbles away from the people they serve. Thus, those we have elected in office have become nothing but self serving. The people who aim to take office in elections are of the self serving kind. They dominate politics because the good guys get snuffed out by the political machine. We have a great host of problems in our government and with the people they represent. This is America's wake up call.


    In case anyone hasn't seen this play upon Thomas Paine, here-


    [youtube="jeYscnFpEyA"]Thomas Paine[/youtube]

  3. #3
    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    Man, you'd do better to look at history as a whole to get that sort of info.



    I'd say ALL governments have used there power this way for one reason or another. That should be obvious. If you want something REALLY obvious, try looking up the 150,000 political prisoners thrown in jail by the early PROGRESSIVE president Wilson. Anyone who spoke out against WW1 was thrown in jail, and laws were even passed that attempted to keep people from speaking against the government and the war, even in their own homes. Wilson was a power hungry type of bastard, based on his own words.

    Obviously, our government has done many bad things through different administrations. History books are your friends. The government today is out of control. The government today has no virtues and no sense of logical direction. They are unaccountable to anyone because we let it become this way. The apathetic public, you and I, have allowed the government to slip away from us and accepted it into the culture that politicians should be exalted and live in physical and mental bubbles away from the people they serve. Thus, those we have elected in office have become nothing but self serving. The people who aim to take office in elections are of the self serving kind. They dominate politics because the good guys get snuffed out by the political machine. We have a great host of problems in our government and with the people they represent. This is America's wake up call.


    In case anyone hasn't seen this play upon Thomas Paine, here-


    [youtube="jeYscnFpEyA"]Thomas Paine[/youtube]
    You're absolutelty right. I guess what I'm trying to say is that people look at the past, and look at the now, and think the present government has come so far and is so much more in line. And it's all bullshit. The more powerful it becomes, the less we hear about it. They're probably doing worse things now on a global level and we don't hear a fucking thing. Obama's great, from what we've seen, but as i do with every figure of authority, I don't trust him. Think of all of the underground business and agreements that he probably makes? As does everyone else with authority, it's all fucking business. Yet people can be naive to overlook this and think it's a lie..it's all a fucking lie. And it happens everywhere, and has been happening forever. Ideally, an anarchy would seem to be the way out, but mass hysteria would result..so we must live with it..that's what I hate the most.
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

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    Quote Originally Posted by OneWithSoul View Post
    Ideally, an anarchy would seem to be the way out, but mass hysteria would result..so we must live with it..that's what I hate the most.

    I was hesitant to address this subject in my civil unrest thread. I believe a lot of people are going to be pushed into thinking this way. I believe, if the government doesn't turn around, they're going to force people into action by it civil action or violent action. If it gets to the point where it boils over to violent action or "revolutionary" unrest, I believe the split it would create in this country would forever destroy what we consider to be the USA. That sort of anarchy at this state of the country would lead us nowhere good, and this is one of my greatest fears.

    However, as economic conditions worsen, a number of other shoes possibly drop (such as Mexico collapse), and we approach a new era of globalism and global governance, I do believe there are those who would seek to tear this country apart from within for the sake of being able to institute such a new order. I know most of America would stand against such globalism. They would not tolerate being beholden to a global form of government, not even in the beginning stages. They would have to tear this country apart and silence the voices of dissent. I believe the most effective way they could do that would be to drive the country into a civil/revolutionary upset (or even war) such that the country breaks apart and the remaining union is something of a police state where liberty and the constitution are essentially dead.

    Our problems must be solved the right way.

    And have I mentioned how gun and ammunition sales have been completely bonkers since Obama was elected? It's at the point where nobody can get ammo. They can't manufacture it fast enough to keep up with the demand because people are hoarding ammo. People are worried and shaken over the future.

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    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    I was hesitant to address this subject in my civil unrest thread. I believe a lot of people are going to be pushed into thinking this way. I believe, if the government doesn't turn around, they're going to force people into action by it civil action or violent action. If it gets to the point where it boils over to violent action or "revolutionary" unrest, I believe the split it would create in this country would forever destroy what we consider to be the USA. That sort of anarchy at this state of the country would lead us nowhere good, and this is one of my greatest fears.

    However, as economic conditions worsen, a number of other shoes possibly drop (such as Mexico collapse), and we approach a new era of globalism and global governance, I do believe there are those who would seek to tear this country apart from within for the sake of being able to institute such a new order. I know most of America would stand against such globalism. They would not tolerate being beholden to a global form of government, not even in the beginning stages. They would have to tear this country apart and silence the voices of dissent. I believe the most effective way they could do that would be to drive the country into a civil/revolutionary upset (or even war) such that the country breaks apart and the remaining union is something of a police state where liberty and the constitution are essentially dead.

    Our problems must be solved the right way.

    And have I mentioned how gun and ammunition sales have been completely bonkers since Obama was elected? It's at the point where nobody can get ammo. They can't manufacture it fast enough to keep up with the demand because people are hoarding ammo. People are worried and shaken over the future.
    Agreed: I don't know how productive a Revolution would be, and it would definitely be hard to control it, especially in today's world. Plus, if their was a revolution..what next? What type of government would be set up next? Something potentially worse? We can't be sure..what if someone comes in and stirs up a Revolution? What if it went global? What if all governments, as we know it, crumbled at some point? It could happen, at the rate of things, all governments are destined to fail. But the thing is, things would be worse without a government..or would they? It's a really tough call, but for now, I'm just pissed with current events and especially they way people view it.
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

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    here is a very interesting report released by Missouri designed to determine whether or not you may be a "militia member" (or anarchist). Some of the criteria in this thing are ridiculous.

    The Modern Militia Movement-Missouri MIAC Strategic Report 20Feb09 - Periodicals & Reports, Terrorist, and report

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    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Some things to read:

    C. Wright Mills - "The Power Elite"
    Eisenhower's Farewell Address - "The Military Industrial Complex"

    Look up Jurgen Habermas and the concept of "legitimation crisis."

    Jürgen Habermas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Legitimation crisis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Basically, when an elite scandal unfolds, such as the Kennedy assassination, Vietnam War, Watergate, Plamegate, etc. the [elite] administration retaliates against anyone who questions their authority (Daniel Ellsberg, Admiral Joseph Wilson (Valerie Plame's husband, etc.), because there is no good defense for the wrongs they have commited, whether for monetary gain, retention of power, etc. They get pissed when their authority is questioned, even when they screw up and are caught red handed. Kind of spooky stuff actually.

    A professor of mine calls the events above "SCADs" or "State Crimes Against Democracy." Those who commit SCADs are typically a high ranking public official and experts in the law. For example, Scooter Libby's sentence was commuted, he was not pardoned. If he were pardoned he could be subpoeaned by a grand jury, since his sentence was commuted he cannot...something like that, a VERY technical legal loophole known only to an elitist legal expert.

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    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halla74 View Post
    Some things to read:

    C. Wright Mills - "The Power Elite"
    Eisenhower's Farewell Address - "The Military Industrial Complex"

    Look up Jurgen Habermas and the concept of "legitimation crisis."

    Jürgen Habermas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Legitimation crisis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Basically, when an elite scandal unfolds, such as the Kennedy assassination, Vietnam War, Watergate, Plamegate, etc. the [elite] administration retaliates against anyone who questions their authority (Daniel Ellsberg, Admiral Joseph Wilson (Valerie Plame's husband, etc.), because there is no good defense for the wrongs they have commited, whether for monetary gain, retention of power, etc. They get pissed when their authority is questioned, even when they screw up and are caught red handed. Kind of spooky stuff actually.

    A professor of mine calls the events above "SCADs" or "State Crimes Against Democracy." Those who commit SCADs are typically a high ranking public official and experts in the law. For example, Scooter Libby's sentence was commuted, he was not pardoned. If he were pardoned he could be subpoeaned by a grand jury, since his sentence was commuted he cannot...something like that, a VERY technical legal loophole known only to an elitist legal expert.
    Very interesting stuff, Halla. I'll have to check out those books.

    What you said is pleasing to hear, in a sense. That there are people out there that aren't stupid. I think of all of the sheltered rich folks that live in large estates that are too naive to accept these concepts..and it seems this population is growing. I wish I could reference this to something, but it's hard. Perhaps I'll stumble into something.

    I am a huge conspiracy theorist, though I'm undecided towards them, but I see both sides to the story. Possibilities fascinate me. 9.11 Conspiracies, Kennedy Assassination Theories, Did We really land on the moon? Things like that where there's a possibility we're being lied to.

    It's all business to the government. Rich folks that go to Ivy League Schools, and enjoy the hefty sums of money they're given by their parents. These people that go on to get government positions for the power and the title, and abuse it! That's what pisses me off so much, that these stupid assholes get up in their rankings and abuse them, and keep it a secret against the people, and they have no fucking idea the full extent of their actions..they have no idea what it's like to be a normal american citizen who has to pay taxes, that has to pay monthly bills, that has to obey every single law layed out to them. Where's the power of the people!?
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

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    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneWithSoul View Post
    Very interesting stuff, Halla. I'll have to check out those books.

    What you said is pleasing to hear, in a sense. That there are people out there that aren't stupid. I think of all of the sheltered rich folks that live in large estates that are too naive to accept these concepts..and it seems this population is growing. I wish I could reference this to something, but it's hard. Perhaps I'll stumble into something.

    I am a huge conspiracy theorist, though I'm undecided towards them, but I see both sides to the story. Possibilities fascinate me. 9.11 Conspiracies, Kennedy Assassination Theories, Did We really land on the moon? Things like that where there's a possibility we're being lied to.

    It's all business to the government. Rich folks that go to Ivy League Schools, and enjoy the hefty sums of money they're given by their parents. These people that go on to get government positions for the power and the title, and abuse it! That's what pisses me off so much, that these stupid assholes get up in their rankings and abuse them, and keep it a secret against the people, and they have no fucking idea the full extent of their actions..they have no idea what it's like to be a normal american citizen who has to pay taxes, that has to pay monthly bills, that has to obey every single law layed out to them. Where's the power of the people!?
    The power of the people is in numbers with guns. No shit. It's the only way things have ever changed in a big way in a short amount of time, and then slowly but surely after a new order is born, a new aristocracy follows it and subjugates the masses to toil at its beckoning.

    Part of being an elite is having lived through similar experiences (Yale Law School, Skull and Bones Society, etc.), having ties to wealth and corporate ownership, and title of public office, in common with other elites. That is why they turn on whistleblowers so radically, because the whistleblower is calling attention not just to another elite behaving badly, but to the elite's overall illegitimate death grip on the future of the children of current taxpayers.

    Why did LBJ diffuse Kennedy's intentions to exit Vietnam? Because the corporate bloodsuckers (aka predecessors to Blackwater and Halliburton) making money on building Cameron Bay and everything else over there swayed him to keep the war alive... It's not just the President running things, it's corporations, political party executives, top military officials (especially intelligence, ala George H.W. Bush), etc.

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    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halla74 View Post
    The power of the people is in numbers with guns. No shit. It's the only way things have ever changed in a big way in a short amount of time, and then slowly but surely after a new order is born, a new aristocracy follows it and subjugates the masses to toil at its beckoning.

    Part of being an elite is having lived through similar experiences (Yale Law School, Skull and Bones Society, etc.), having ties to wealth and corporate ownership, and title of public office, in common with other elites. That is why they turn on whistleblowers so radically, because the whistleblower is calling attention not just to another elite behaving badly, but to the elite's overall illegitimate death grip on the future of the children of current taxpayers.

    Why did LBJ diffuse Kennedy's intentions to exit Vietnam? Because the corporate bloodsuckers (aka predecessors to Blackwater and Halliburton) making money on building Cameron Bay and everything else over there swayed him to keep the war alive... It's not just the President running things, it's corporations, political party executives, top military officials (especially intelligence, ala George H.W. Bush), etc.
    Yeah, a revolution would quite literally be a revolution, in that in the end, we'd end up in the same spot again.

    It's all business for them, when one messes up, it's the money that comes back to hurt them and their businesses. Corporate America, and the Corporate world really do regulate the government far too much.
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

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