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  1. #11
    I'm a star. Kangirl's Avatar
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    Sure, sure, but what about your dog, if he thought there was going to be peanut butter involved?
    Involvement of peanut butter = all bets are off.

    On topic, there was a report released about 1-2 years ago - I think by the CIA - detailing possible scenarios if extreme global warming were to happen. I could try and find a link but I remember it said that a likely outcome was the USA 'coming to an agreement' with Canada because they would be in great need of our resources and we would be in great need of their security/power.

    EDIT: I *think* this is the report - I need to have a closer look but here's a link. It looks like it was written for the Pentagon and published in Fortune Magazine in 2004: http://zfacts.com/metaPage/lib/Abrup...nge2003-1-.pdf (PDF)
    "Only an irrational dumbass, would burn Jews." - Jaguar

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  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangirl View Post
    Involvement of peanut butter = all bets are off.

    On topic, there was a report released about 1-2 years ago - I think by the CIA - detailing possible scenarios if extreme global warming were to happen. I could try and find a link but I remember it said that a likely outcome was the USA 'coming to an agreement' with Canada because they would be in great need of our resources and we would be in great need of their security/power.

    EDIT: I *think* this is the report - I need to have a closer look but here's a link. It looks like it was written for the Pentagon and published in Fortune Magazine in 2004: http://zfacts.com/metaPage/lib/Abrup...nge2003-1-.pdf (PDF)
    It's likely that the planet will face a shortage of basic resources like food and water, but it sure as hell wont be due to global warming. Maaaaaaaaaaybe global cooling judging by the fact that it has been cooling the past 10 years, and food is always easier to grow in a warmer global climate (when there is enough water) than in cooler periods. If you pick up a history book, you'll see civilizations have always been hurt by periods of planetary cooling, and had plentiful resources during warming periods.

  3. #13
    I'm a star. Kangirl's Avatar
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    Risen, I don't believe global warming is happening either - especially the man-made kind, so no need to convince me of what you just posted, I already believe it.

    I posted that link because, beyond the impetus for the report (global warming zomg!) it's actually very interesting in how it looks at different scenarios and how they would play out in the face of a global catastrophe.

    EDIT: Found some of the stuff I was talking about pertaining to the USA(again, ignore the 'global warming' bit and just imagine it as 'global climate change for whatever reason' and ignore the dates as well):

    "2010: Disagreements with Canada and Mexico over water increase tension
    2012: Flood of refugees to southeast U.S. and Mexico from Caribbean islands
    2015: European migration to United States (mostly wealthy)
    2016: Conflict with European countries over fishing rights
    2018: Securing North America, U.S. forms integrated security alliance with Canada and Mexico
    2020: Department of Defense manages borders and refugees from Caribbean and Europe."
    2020: Oil prices increase as security of supply is threatened by conflicts in Persian Gulf and Caspian
    2025: Internal struggle in Saudi Arabia brings Chinese and U.S. naval forces to Gulf ,in direct confrontation

    Here's what it speculated about Europe:

    2012: Severe drought and cold push Scandinavian populations southward, push back from EU
    2015: Conflict within the EU over food and water supply leads to skirmishes and strained diplomatic relations
    2018: Russia joins EU, providing energy resources
    2020: Migration from northern countries such as Holland and Germany toward Spain and Italy
    2020: Increasing: skirmishes over water and immigration
    2022: Skirmish between France and Germany over commercial access to Rhine
    2025: EU nears collapse
    2027: Increasing migration to Mediterranean countries such as Algeria, Morocco, Egypt, and Israel
    2030: Nearly 10% of European population moves to a different country.

    MORE:

    The United States and Australia are likely to build defensive fortresses around their countries because they have the resources and reserves to achieve self-sufficiency. With diverse growing climates, wealth, technology, and abundant resources, the United States could likely survive shortened growing cycles and harsh weather conditions without catastrophic losses. Borders will be strengthened around the country to hold back unwanted starving immigrants from the Caribbean islands (an especially severe problem), Mexico, and South America. Energy supply will be shored up through expensive (economically, politically, and morally) alternatives such as nuclear, renewables, hydrogen, and Middle Eastern contracts. Pesky skirmishes over fishing rights, agricultural support, and disaster relief will be commonplace. Tension between the U.S. and Mexico rise as the U.S. reneges on the 1944 treaty that guarantees water flow from the Colorado River. Relief workers will be commissioned to respond to flooding along the southern part of the east coast and much drier conditions inland. Yet, even in this continuous state of emergency the U.S. will be positioned well compared to others. The intractable problem facing the nation will be calming the mounting military tension around the world...

    In this scenario, we can expect alliances of convenience. The United States and Canada may become one, simplifying border controls. Or, Canada might keep its hydropower—causing energy problems in the US. North and South Korea may align to create one technically savvy and nuclear-armed entity. Europe may act as a unified block – curbing immigration problems between European nations – and allowing for protection against aggressors. Russia, with its abundant minerals, oil, and natural gas may join Europe.
    I just find this kind of speculation fascinating, is all.
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  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangirl View Post
    Risen, I don't believe global warming is happening either - especially the man-made kind, so no need to convince me of what you just posted, I already believe it.

    I posted that link because, beyond the impetus for the report (global warming zomg!) it's actually very interesting in how it looks at different scenarios and how they would play out in the face of a global catastrophe.
    Yea, the government really does have to prepare for the worst and think of all the worst case (within the realm of possibility) scenarios because they must be prepared. The average person, on the other hand, often fails to think of such things. Not that it helps much at all to think of doom and gloom when it is not staring you in the face.

  5. #15
    I'm a star. Kangirl's Avatar
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    See my edit above, Risen. I'm not sure but I think you might find the report interesting, based on what I know about you.

    Hmmmm. Now I'm tempted to start a survivalism thread. What's in *your* BOB?
    "Only an irrational dumbass, would burn Jews." - Jaguar

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  6. #16
    Senior Member Feops's Avatar
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    Somewhat related to the whole disaster scenario.. why are all climate changes considered to be bad? An increase of disruptive weather, a decrease of workable land, etc.

    Are we (or were we) at a perceived peak of environmental stability and productivity?

  7. #17
    Babylon Candle Venom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    There's just no evidence or logical reasoning behind such a things.
    says the guy who is convinced that there really IS an illuminati take over, planning to bring on Armageddon through the one world government...

    :yim_rolling_on_the_:

  8. #18
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    It's likely that the planet will face a shortage of basic resources like food and water, but it sure as hell wont be due to global warming. Maaaaaaaaaaybe global cooling judging by the fact that it has been cooling the past 10 years, and food is always easier to grow in a warmer global climate (when there is enough water) than in cooler periods. If you pick up a history book, you'll see civilizations have always been hurt by periods of planetary cooling, and had plentiful resources during warming periods.
    Oh please, now we're reaching ridiculous levels. First of all, that article says absolutely nothing about what are the causes of the possible "5th phas", neither about how should it develop; secondly, we should absolutely stop looking at 5 or 10 year cycles in global temperatures, because the variation we notice is 95% caused by white noise (even the "small glaciations" of the 19th century can easily be interpreted as noise), it's impossible to notice, in such a short time-interval, trends that take millions of years to form.
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Oh please, now we're reaching ridiculous levels. First of all, that article says absolutely nothing about what are the causes of the possible "5th phas", neither about how should it develop; secondly, we should absolutely stop looking at 5 or 10 year cycles in global temperatures, because the variation we notice is 95% caused by white noise (even the "small glaciations" of the 19th century can easily be interpreted as noise), it's impossible to notice, in such a short time-interval, trends that take millions of years to form.
    Hence why I said "maybe" with about 10 A's in it for emphasis on the MAYBE. Some experts and scientists believe a great cooling period is more likely than runaway warming, but either way the climate is always changing. However, the trends that effect agriculture do not take millions of years to form, merely decades. Like I said, archeology and history has shown that past cultures around the globe have been adversely affected by changes in climate, where especially cooler periods reduced their ability to grow crops and feed themselves, often leading to population declines, and warmer periods produced more food leading to population growth and expansion.

    And if you'll actually read the thread the thread instead of looking for my most "ridiculous" posts of the day, you'll know why global warming was mentioned in the first place.

    Quote Originally Posted by Babylon Candle View Post
    says the guy who is convinced that there really IS an illuminati take over, planning to bring on Armageddon through the one world government...

    :yim_rolling_on_the_:
    Apparently that's what you believe, because I never suggested that. I said globalists and people with a vested interest in consolidating power globally. Merely wealthy and powerful people with similar interests. As for armageddon... whatever.

  10. #20
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    The fact that, as a cause for a global crisis, BOTH global warming and global cooling can be mentioned, simply means that we are completely clueless.
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

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