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View Poll Results: What do you think of exercising 'eye for an eye' retribution?

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  • 'Eye for an eye' is as ancient as it is just.

    19 42.22%
  • I'm with Gandhi on this; 'an eye for an eye will make the whole world blind!"

    20 44.44%
  • Well... <insert commentary via post>

    6 13.33%
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  1. #31
    Senior Member Lookin4theBestNU's Avatar
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    Ghandi was great but I think the punishment is totally deserved. Women don't always get the best treatment in other cultures. Hopefully, seeing some follow through on such punishments will make at least one person think twice about committing such an act. The fact that you get to CHOOSE the punishment?!? I believe we could use a little of that in my own culture! I wouldn't take the money and you could bet on that! It's not like it was an accident you know?
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  2. #32
    Mamma said knock you out Mempy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by InaF3157 View Post
    She's not fooling anyone. It's obviously retribution. And that's okay. Retribution unfairly gets a bad rap.
    That's what I was thinking. I don't get why it gets such a bad rap either, as though you can really will en emotion like wanting revenge away all that easily. I'd want swift and powerful retribution. I'd have revenge coming out the gills. I think it's natural.

    But. I do wonder if it will make her happier, in the long run. Or even the short run. It's natural to want to harm those who have harmed you, but I am skeptical about the benefits (for the avenger) of actually carrying through with this course of action. I'm not sure. I'm more a believer in the theory that hate breeds only more hate, not that two wrongs cancel each other (and the hate involved) out. In that sense, I don't think that breeding more hate in the heart of any human is overall more beneficial for the human race, so if she wants to benefit the human race, I'd factor that in, if I were her.

    Do you think this punishment will do anything to make him a better person? Do you think being blinded will make him more capable of treating others with respect and compassion? Hmmm. I'd say no, but that's an initial guess.

    Her logic that blinding him will set an example - and ultimately benefit the human race - is pretty good. It probably will set an example. But he's already spent, what, three years in prison? That's no small price. Nothing as great as sight, but three years of your life is not a small price. I think something of an example may have already been set. Hopefully, a vengeful man (oh, there's that word again) will ask himself before throwing acid on a woman who has not returned his affections, "Is this worth spending three or more years in prison?"

    I'd need to know a lot more about it to come to a more solid decision on it - how common this acid-throwing problem is, how common severe punishments are for offenders, etc.

    Edit: In retrospect, this whole scenario seems to have started with revenge - revenge for perceived wrongs, real or imagined. He wrongs her because she rejects him; it must seem a suitable form of revenge, something she deserves, in his mind. Then she wrongs him by invoking the law of "an eye for an eye." And it probably goes on and on, until someone says, "No, I don't think we'll be doing that."
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  3. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    In any case, I really don't give a shit (pun intended) about a couple of idiots in Iran when there are much more important stories within your own country.
    Riiiiiiiiight, because ignoring other country's issues/discussions/problems/laws is the best way to navigate our own.



    Quote Originally Posted by Jen View Post
    I guess the moral to this story is don't date assholes.
    She wasn't dating him.

    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    ...throwing acid on the faces of women is a relatively common form of assault in the Middle East (including Iran, Afghanistan, and Pakistan). Its usually meant as a form of terrorism, making an example out of a women who challenge prevailing cultural and religious attitudes, such as not wearing a Burkha or attempting to go to school. Its actually a very serious regional problem (along with "honor killings"), and part of the woman's motivation might very well be to make an example of this perpetrator-people here have dismissed that possibility too hastily.
    I'm aware, but I suppose it bears repeating.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mempy View Post
    But. I do wonder if it will make her happier, in the long run. Or even the short run. It's natural to want to harm those who have harmed you, but I am skeptical about the benefits (for the avenger) of actually carrying through with this course of action. I'm not sure. I'm more a believer in the theory that hate breeds only more hate, not that two wrongs cancel each other (and the hate involved) out. In that sense, I don't think that breeding more hate in the heart of any human is overall more beneficial for the human race, so if she wants to benefit the human race, I'd factor that in, if I were her.
    Bah, I should've just multi-quoted you guys and had done done with it!

    Anyhow, I'm thinking to myself, let's hope this lady's hatred doesn't subside over the years. She can't return his vision any more than he can return hers. Can eventual remorse do more damage than immediate hate?
    Last edited by MacGuffin; 02-21-2009 at 12:01 AM. Reason: Merging 4 post(s)
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  4. #34
    RETIRED CzeCze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erm View Post
    Even if you were a moral relativist, it would mean you respect both acid throwing and any retribution for it as moral systems equal to any other.
    Well, dang, fughet that!

    Moral relativism generally means nothing on it's own. It simultaneously supports contradicting moralities.
    This is true. Moral relativism is merely a lens to view things, it acknowledges everyone's platform and above all supports the concept of Context (captial c).

    I also believe in context and acting appropriately for the situation. I believe asking for an 'eye for an eye' can be barbaric and can bring down society's overall standards for acceptable and proper behavior. It can be a degenerative strategy in that it just propogates more and more retribution.

    Also, when talking about the death penalty and corporal punishment, it's not just about the people and the case inolved, it is a decision that reflects back upon and affects society.

    HOWEVER - considering the larger situation in the OP example is already so extreme and essentially lawless, it would take extreme measures to bring it back to center.
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  5. #35
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Seeing as how it is not myself, or what I would do, but her and her situation. I voted eye-for-an-eye. It's within her legal rights, and if the law upholds her right to take his eyes away, than she has every right to do so. I wouldn't want ANYONE trying to tell me that someone, who for example: killed my family, and got the death penalty, shouldn't be harshly punished.

    If her revenge is strong enough to refuse all that blood money for all the debt she's accumulated from this, then there's nothing that can be done. I agree with Anja that harsh punishments do work... but they generally make for harsh people as well. There's consequences to everything.
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  6. #36
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    Surely an eye for an eye would mean the woman would need to be sentenced to three years in jail, in order to make it fair?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mempy View Post
    Her logic that blinding him will set an example - and ultimately benefit the human race - is pretty good. It probably will set an example.
    There have been many studies that show preventive punishment does not work as desired. (Mostly around capital punishment)

    The theory goes that most major crimes are either done in the heat of the moment with no thoughts of the consequences, done out of desperation with no other choice, or consciously planned with no intention of getting caught. In all three cases not much thought is given to the punishment.

    Speculation: It can work when an extreme punishment is given to a minor crime, but I doubt someone willing to blind a person out of vengeance (the man in this case) is going to care about the consequences. He probably knew full well he'd end up in jail for a long time.

    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    Moral relativism is merely a lens to view things, it acknowledges everyone's platform and above all supports the concept of Context (captial c).
    It only supports context in explaining where people's moralities come from. Even that is not a necessary requirement for being a moral relativist.

    Other than that context is irrelevant to a moral relativist. (Assuming no other beliefs come into play)

    Just to make sure, my point is not about your personal viewpoint, you said yourself you are not necessarily a moral relativist.
    I'm making this point because I often observe people who claim to be a moral relativist yet still make alogical judgements on situations.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    Bah, I should've just multi-quoted you guys and had done done with it!

    Anyhow, I'm thinking to myself, let's hope this lady's hatred doesn't subside over the years. She can't return his vision any more than he can return hers. Can eventual remorse do more damage than immediate hate?
    How about if he donated his eyes to her?

    And his family raised money for the surgery?

    Out of the goodness of their hearts.

    And to avoid the death penalty.
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  8. #38
    Senior Member Lookin4theBestNU's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erm
    Surely an eye for an eye would mean the woman would need to be sentenced to three years in jail, in order to make it fair?
    She's already serving her prison sentence. It's called being blind.
    "At points of clarity, I realize that my life on earth is meaningless, and that I am merely a pawn in a bigger game. A game I cannot possibly understand or have control of. Thankfully, before depression sets in, I drift back into my cloudy, bewildered daily routine." **Joel Patrick Warneke**

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lookin4theBestNU View Post
    She's already serving her prison sentence. It's called being blind.
    So the man gets three years in jail (presumably more to come) and blindness.

    The woman gets blindness at least three years prior to the man.

    Which one is worse, blindness or prison?

    Certainly any years spent in prison while blinded by the man would have to be equalled by the woman in order for it to be an "eye for an eye".

  10. #40
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erm View Post
    So the man gets three years in jail (presumably more to come) and blindness.

    The woman gets blindness at least three years prior to the man.

    Which one is worse, blindness or prison?

    Certainly any years spent in prison while blinded by the man would have to be equalled by the woman in order for it to be an "eye for an eye".
    Blindness. He gets out of prison eventually. You never get out of being blind. You only adjust and manage as necessary, not to mention the life-long things you miss out on in the process.
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