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View Poll Results: What do you think of exercising 'eye for an eye' retribution?

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  • 'Eye for an eye' is as ancient as it is just.

    19 42.22%
  • I'm with Gandhi on this; 'an eye for an eye will make the whole world blind!"

    20 44.44%
  • Well... <insert commentary via post>

    6 13.33%
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  1. #161
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    The 31-year-old Iranian is demanding the ancient punishment of "an eye for an eye," and, in accordance with Islamic law, she wants to blind Majid Movahedi, the man who blinded her.
    She is free to exercise her legal right. Enough said.

  2. #162

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    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    While there is a concept of universal morality I think this goes beyond 'morals' it's about social consequences and order. I'm a cultural relativist. There, I said it. Different cultures, different rules, different society - in this case the punishment does meet the crime in a crudely balanced way. Cutting off a thief's hand, that to me is not the same kind of 'eye for an eye' punishment. Reposessing all or most of a thief's goods and cash - that's more accurate.

    Even in peace and justice movements, there is usually a need for militance/violence as well as pacifism. It's about context.

    She is not just making a stand for herself, but she says herself this is to prevent others from committing the same crime. I'm sure other would-be acid throwers will think twice once they realize, "holy shit, people actually look DOWN on this?" I would guess this woman has thought about it a lot, and even if there is a high degree of bitterness in her decision, she is doing it on larger principles that are still sound. And she understands she will carry the burden of "having done this to someone". I don't believe it is being done purely out of spite, and even if it were, the larger (positive/balancing) effects on society would remain similar.

    When people are in a knock down, drag out fight for their lives, I don't lecture them from the comfort of my luxury skybox seats and explain to them how it's not polite to slap people in the face after they rip out your weave. That's cultural relativist me.
    Never mind the 2009 time stamp, I don't know what your post has to do with mine or why you quoted it.

    Also, are you aware she opted to spare him hence the point of resurrecting the topic...?

  3. #163
    RETIRED CzeCze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    Never mind the 2009 time stamp, I don't know what your post has to do with mine or why you quoted it.
    HA - didn't see that. I usually don't notice time stamps, I just know if a thread is active.

    Also, I often quote the OP in entirety, especially after the thread has taken off several pages - just to delineate that I'm commenting on the OP article or whatnot in question and not the most recent comments. Aside from the quoted actual article, there wasn't much of your own comments in your OP for me to comment on let alone rebut - I was giving my thoughts on the situation outlined in the article and the question in the title of this thread.

    Also, are you aware she opted to spare him hence the point of resurrecting the topic...?
    I am now.

    However, my original comments still stand. If she had gone through with the 'eye for an eye' I would have been fine with it and think she was in her rights.
    “If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.” ― Oscar Wilde

    "I'm outtie 5000" ― Romulux

    Johari/Nohari

  4. #164

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    I am curious to know why she changed her mind exactly. I didn't read an article where she gave an explicit reason.
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  5. #165
    Emerging Tallulah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    I am curious to know why she changed her mind exactly. I didn't read an article where she gave an explicit reason.
    I read an article somewhere that said she had been talking to a couple of counselors...I can't remember their exact job titles or anything, but they encouraged her to embrace the idea that forgiveness is the true expression of Islam, or something about showing the world a better example of Islam, etc. I can't remember which article it was, though. It was a spiritual thing, though.

    Even though I probably would have made the exact same decisions she did--wanting him to pay and be made an example, but ultimately losing the stomach to do it--I do think there needs to be a deterrent in place--a major one-- to scare the crap out of these whackjobs who go around avenging their wounded masculinity with a cup of acid to the face of the woman who scorned them. There is still something that bothers me to the core about people who do things like that without another thought, forever altering someone's life, then are scared crapless at the thought of it happening to them. That thought needs to happen before they do it, for pete's sake. Whatever attitude is causing that type of mindset, it needs to be eradicated.
    Something Witty

  6. #166

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallulah View Post
    I read an article somewhere that said she had been talking to a couple of counselors...I can't remember their exact job titles or anything, but they encouraged her to embrace the idea that forgiveness is the true expression of Islam, or something about showing the world a better example of Islam, etc. I can't remember which article it was, though. It was a spiritual thing, though.

    Even though I probably would have made the exact same decisions she did--wanting him to pay and be made an example, but ultimately losing the stomach to do it--I do think there needs to be a deterrent in place--a major one-- to scare the crap out of these whackjobs who go around avenging their wounded masculinity with a cup of acid to the face of the woman who scorned them. There is still something that bothers me to the core about people who do things like that without another thought, forever altering someone's life, then are scared crapless at the thought of it happening to them. That thought needs to happen before they do it, for pete's sake. Whatever attitude is causing that type of mindset, it needs to be eradicated.
    It's a dangerous thing called "a sense of entitlement."
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  7. #167
    RETIRED CzeCze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    It's a dangerous thing called "a sense of entitlement."
    I watched a special on workplace massacres - disgruntled employees who flip out and take out half the office. That concept was exactly what distinguished a 'normal' disgruntled employee from one who feels the need to exact vengeance - a sense of entitlement. They deserved that promotion, hard

    When it comes to gender specific violence, school house murders, that guy who shot into an aerobics class, also this case with the acid - I'd say "sense of entitlement" plus personal misogyny/women issues plus a culture that is permissive or encouraging of a gendered sense of entitlement.

    Your description of the article Tallullah reminds me of US Healthcare - how there is little to no preventative education or measures in place to head off very predictable diseases. But, as soon as you're on the operating table with a heart attack you get hit with tons of medication, emergency medical care, and bills. Nobody seems to be doing anything to prevent these 'spurned lover attacks' but as soon as this woman is attacked and wants to do the same everyone comes out of the wood work to counsel her and pressure her out of 'committing more violence'. I agree they should be focusing on the root of the problem and prevention. There's always so much more burden placed on victims than any attention given to would be and actual perpetrators.
    “If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.” ― Oscar Wilde

    "I'm outtie 5000" ― Romulux

    Johari/Nohari

  8. #168
    Emerging Tallulah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    It's a dangerous thing called "a sense of entitlement."
    Quote Originally Posted by CzeCze View Post
    I watched a special on workplace massacres - disgruntled employees who flip out and take out half the office. That concept was exactly what distinguished a 'normal' disgruntled employee from one who feels the need to exact vengeance - a sense of entitlement. They deserved that promotion, hard

    When it comes to gender specific violence, school house murders, that guy who shot into an aerobics class, also this case with the acid - I'd say "sense of entitlement" plus personal misogyny/women issues plus a culture that is permissive or encouraging of a gendered sense of entitlement.

    Your description of the article Tallullah reminds me of US Healthcare - how there is little to no preventative education or measures in place to head off very predictable diseases. But, as soon as you're on the operating table with a heart attack you get hit with tons of medication, emergency medical care, and bills. Nobody seems to be doing anything to prevent these 'spurned lover attacks' but as soon as this woman is attacked and wants to do the same everyone comes out of the wood work to counsel her and pressure her out of 'committing more violence'. I agree they should be focusing on the root of the problem and prevention. There's always so much more burden placed on victims than any attention given to would be and actual perpetrators.
    I couldn't agree more, and CzeCze, you make a good point...we (as humans, not just in one country) need to really look into the idea of prevention rather than punishment. Which is not to say that punishment will never be necessary, because people will still invariably do crazy stuff like this. I really like the idea of the parallel to medicine. We are much more apt to treat the symptoms than diagnose the root. And like with medicine, people will endlessly debate the cause and whether certain methods of prevention really do any good, etc. Making some strides toward eradicating institutional misogyny would be a great start. I imagine that knowing you live in a country in which it takes the lives of two women to equal that of a man's would tend to empower some with this sense of entitlement.
    Something Witty

  9. #169

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    @CzeCze. That's just my point, an entire society granting one sex entitlement over the other.
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  10. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    @CzeCze. That's just my point, an entire society granting one sex entitlement over the other.
    We are in agreement then.

    You crazy feminist, you.
    “If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.” ― Oscar Wilde

    "I'm outtie 5000" ― Romulux

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