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Thread: Obama Snubs Nation's Heroes, Becomes the First President to Skip Ball Honoring Medal

  1. #101
    Nerd King Usurper Array Edgar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dga View Post
    no, my argument is that the symoblism is meaningless.
    Yeah, ok, you lost me after that sentence...

  2. #102
    Minister of Propagandhi Array ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    Sure, lots of individual celebrities made significant contributions to Obama's campaign. As "celebrities from Hollywood" is not some cohesive body of people, however, it would have been impossible for Obama to attend to all of them in some sort of deliberate, systematic fashion that's being suggested here. Instead, we see him going to ten official balls where some celebrities are present (including at a military ball), and we conclude from this that he's pandering to celebrities. I'm just saying that this is an erroneous conclusion to draw from the fact that he didn't attend the StH ball, and the fact that celebrities were present at the other balls.
    I agree that it's a faulty conclusion to draw. But I assume that the planning of the inauguration balls had been going on for some time prior, and celebrity and Hollywood supporters were very well represented. I wouldn't conclude that it's necessarily pandering, but it certainly shows a favorable relationship between some of the most famous supporters and his administration. Not that that's a bad thing.

  3. #103
    Nerd King Usurper Array Edgar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    I will get to my point.

    Probably almost all of them have earned them in Afghanistan or Iraq.

    The thing is that war in Iraq is ilegal operation from the position of international law. From the position of foreign policy it would be suicidal to attain something like this. Since you can't come just on a half of entire thing it is better not to come at all.
    Whoa whoa, hold on there.

    Let me get this straight. You think that since the war in Iraq "violated international law" (whatever the fuck that is), you think Obama did the right thing by snubbing the American veterans?

    Did I get that right?

  4. #104

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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    I don't see any notations indicating that the CiC ball was at the SAME TIME or would conflict SEVERELY with the MoH ball. So, your first statement means a bit of nothing to me. To you, this is what makes sense. To me, He has a responsibility to honor those of the past. He has 4 years to honor me.
    It wasn't a question of time conflict. It was a question of, 2 balls towards military, so to pick one of the two....because I don't yet see the justification for why military should get THAT MUCH attention. USA, to me, I hope is more than its military force.

    I also believe most of the balls were running concurrently, and the president made an appearance at each one for short periods of time to each, regardless of when the ball started or ended.

    To me, very important = something you might even have to go out of the way for to ensure you attend. I'm not going to get into the reasons why going out of your way to honor those that set the standards for our military soldiers is important. If you don't think that is at all important, my words aren't going to change your mind.
    I don't see how, relatively speaking, we can hold a person to such contempt over missing out on a ball out of the over 100 (I believe) balls given on that day for his honor. Hence, me asking about what is important, in terms of heirarchy (which would mean, you have to take into account ALL the balls, and place them in a systematic order for why x choice OVER y).

    And, doing that, I ended up with 2 military balls - choose 1. He made a choice for diplomacy. Obama, I'm sure we can all agree, probably gave very careful consideration, when choosing from all the balls, which one he would attend. And, I'm sure it wasn't a revelation to him what missing out on the Heroe's ball would do. He made a strategic choice which is reflective of his campaign for: (a) rebuilding diplomacy b/w US with the international community (and how they view us), (b) downplay the synonymous notion that USA=military as many have come to know USA as of current. There is more to USA than sheer physical force, and I believe this president is out to prove that.

    That does not, however mean that him not going to the ball means he doesn't support it (or its cause). Like you challenged: it is not either/or, so ...

    If you don't think that is at all important, my words aren't going to change your mind.
    ...may be construed as unfair allegation against me, my friend. Not thinking it's as important as other obligations (considering one nod to the military is enough), and not thinking it's not important at all...not the same.

  5. #105
    Guerilla Urbanist Array Brendan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beat View Post
    ^Did you read the article and look at the balls he did attend? The first president to avoid this particular ball... I don't see that as being a mere slip of the brain or something.

    I expect our president to be a "cheerleader" at a ceremony where troops are awarded Medals of Honor and stuff...
    How many balls did he not attend besides the Salute to Heroes Ball?
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  6. #106
    Protocol Droid Array Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    It is the best because, of all our military, the medal of Honor winners best represent us as the military. It is everything civilians hear about in stories, and everything anyone who wants to be a real soldier aspire to be. To pick any event over this one, it is a big deal.
    Well, now I think I get it. This ball represents the ideals of the military itself. So he didn't just miss a party, he brushed aside those ideals, which you valued.

    I probably don't get it because I have no desire to be a soldier and don't understand that mentality, so I'll take your word for it.

  7. #107
    Emperor/Dictator Array kyuuei's Avatar
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    ^ This is it exactly. It doesn't matter if he missed 10, 20, 100 balls for the military.. It didn't matter at all.. but it should be an honor to meet those men that got those medals, and it is nothing shy of outrage that he didn't at least issue a formal apology to them in advance if he was not going to be there.

    "Not thinking it's as important as other obligations (considering one nod to the military is enough), and not thinking it's not important at all...not the same. "

    My words simply meant I'm going in circles, and I don't like arguing over the same points again and again. I think it's important to nod at the military..I think it's also important to nod at those of the past. They are no longer military, they are veterans. They have already done their time, but more importantly.. They are the standards set so that we can have freedom. They're heroes, just like we celebrate Martin Luther King day because he was a hero.. We held a ball to support them. Something above the rest. That's my point. It isn't that it's just any ball, or just any scheduled event. It was something much more important than that. No apology even? He has advisors and staff all over the place.. surely someone noticed they were going to miss something like this. He had time to create and make an official apology, or attend. I think it's rude he did not at least do that much. A poor decision made on his part. And an Outrageous one to me, personally, as someone who KNOWS how hard it would have to be to even be in a position to go above and beyond what you're called to do.. and to go even farther than that?? Nothing less than a hero. And should be treated as nothing less.

    So I'll kindly bow out. I've made me argument clear, and those who agree will.. and those who don't aren't soon going to be swayed by my ramblings. I'll just talk till I'm blue in the face and that's not very attractive at all.
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  8. #108
    Queen hunter Array Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Whoa whoa, hold on there.

    Let me get this straight. You think that since the war in Iraq "violated international law" (whatever the fuck that is), you think Obama did the right thing by snubbing the American veterans?

    Did I get that right?
    If you look at the big picture he did the right thing. For perspective of small picture he did the wrong thing.

    If things are the way I think they are then he did the right thing.

  9. #109
    Senior Member Array swordpath's Avatar
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    ^forgive me if it's been stated but what is this "right thing" he did?

  10. #110
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    Wow, big deal. When something important happens (such as this) let me know. Such as if he decides to leave our troops without proper supplies and weapons or puts them in harms way causing thousands to die unnecessarily. Sure he could have gone but he didn't and I'm sure there was a reason. Nice spin tho.

    PS also if this Ball such a huge deal why isn't there more media coverage informing us that it's approaching? I mean why wait until a President doesn't show. I wonder if he is the only President who has never made an appearance? And what's with Oprah not being at any of the 10 Balls the Obama's went to? What's this world coming to?!?

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