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  1. #91
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elaur View Post
    Antisocial One, did you miss my reference to vietnam? This is an unacceptable viewpoint after the shameful way Vietnam vets were treated after the war. Please take time to listen this time.

    That is why you see no one agreeing with you.
    No I did not miss that.

    But I did not change my opinion about this topic because of it.


    Also I am not here searching for someone to agree with me I am trying to show the picture how it looks form outside and entire thing is logical if you watch it from this perspective.

    At this stage Obama can't afford to look like someone who does not respect international law.

    Even if most of the medal receivers are dead, that does not change things much.

  2. #92
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Since it's relevant, I'd like to point out that when it comes to veteran aid and rights, Obama is pretty solid. Supporting veteran health care aid, homeless programs, PTSD support....

    Veterans Rights | Barack Obama | veteranjournal.com

  3. #93
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post

    I've served for 4 years, never did anything worth medals and accomplished little. Honoring those who went above and beyond what they were contracted to do is entirely different imo.
    If you are still currently serving, then Obama has way more of a responsibility to YOU, than any ideal-attached sentiment to those that have fought in the history of US military. He's YOUR commander in chief, however much or however little you accomplish, it would, from now on until his term is over, be under HIS command, and HIS guidance. Hence, he will be directly responsible now for the outcome of you (general: all currently serving) and your military career. Comparatively speaking, i.e., if given a choice of only EITHER/OR. In terms of the two balls hosted that evening with regards to military.

    It has nothing to do with Obama as a man, or anyone..
    Never challenged that he wasn't a man.

    It has to do with a President missing something very important, even if the media and schedule didn't deem it so.
    What qualifies as very important? On a heirarchy in terms of his commitments for that night's events?

    Anyone who tells me that left-winged people wouldn't have been all "OMG BUSH WAS THE FIRST PREZ TO MISS THE MOH BALL. SEE WHY HE'S EVIL NAO?!" had better eat their hats now.
    I'd gladly eat my hat, cuz I could see the prediction being that left-winged people soften to his Bushism, and actually then predict that those leftist thoughts of Bush being a power-hungry, military-minded org would probably subside....

    However, I can only predict the outrage by the right-wing (aside from the apologists - which in recent campaigns have been the majority) for such a move from *their* Bush. = :steam:

  4. #94
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    If you are still currently serving, then Obama has way more of a responsibility to YOU, than any ideal-attached sentiment to those that have fought in the history of US military. He's YOUR commander in chief, however much or however little you accomplish, it would, from now on until his term is over, be under HIS command, and HIS guidance. Hence, he will be directly responsible now for the outcome of you (general: all currently serving) and your military career. Comparatively speaking, i.e., if given a choice of only EITHER/OR. In terms of the two balls hosted that evening with regards to military.

    Never challenged that he wasn't a man.

    What qualifies as very important? On a heirarchy in terms of his commitments for that night's events?

    I'd gladly eat my hat, cuz I could see the prediction being that left-winged people soften to his Bushism, and actually then predict that those leftist thoughts of Bush being a power-hungry, military-minded org would probably subside....

    However, I can only predict the outrage by the right-wing (aside from the apologists - which in recent campaigns have been the majority) for such a move from *their* Bush. = :steam:
    I don't see any notations indicating that the CiC ball was at the SAME TIME or would conflict SEVERELY with the MoH ball. So, your first statement means a bit of nothing to me. To you, this is what makes sense. To me, He has a responsibility to honor those of the past. He has 4 years to honor me.

    If anyone presents any evidence that the CiC ball was timed in a way to severely conflict with the MoH ball, my argument could be changed entirely. As of yet, I don't see it.

    and I didn't mean Obama was a woman. :rolli: I meant Obama as a particular person in the President's slot. It could have been Reagan and I'd still have been steaming.

    To me, very important = something you might even have to go out of the way for to ensure you attend. I'm not going to get into the reasons why going out of your way to honor those that set the standards for our military soldiers is important. If you don't think that is at all important, my words aren't going to change your mind.

    First, I already stated I would absolutely livid, as opposed to merely annoyed with, if this situation were Bush instead of Obama. A second term, attending the first, and then missing the second? I'd be screaming in the streets. But don't think for a second I don't hear the evils of Bush at every pass and fold, and that there aren't people looking for more things to add to their greedy list. Just as I have to hear all the "evil Obama" crap from my dad, he's eager to find new information. I don't see Left-winged people being so insanely different that they'd go all silent and reserved over anything.
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  5. #95
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hmm View Post
    The pandering to celebrities crap is a load of crap, but what is not a load of crap is the fact that the CiC ball was in honor of The President, not the men and women who serve in the armed forces like the MOH ball was. The CiC event he choose to go to was a celebration of his election and in his honor, the other event was to celebrate the vets service and in their honor.
    I thought it was the opposite. The CiC ball was intended to be in honor of the armed forces, not as a celebration of Obama's becoming commander in chief. Here's a quote from Obama regarding this event:

    "It is a privilege to honor our men and women in uniform during our inaugural festivities by continuing the tradition of the Commander-in-Chiefís Ball. Our troops represent the best America has to offer, and without their dedication and sacrifice we would not be able to enjoy the freedoms that we are coming together to celebrate on January 20th. They deserve our thanks and our gratitude. Michelle and I look forward to attending the Commander-in-Chiefís Ball and sharing this special evening with representatives of our armed forces."

    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    They made the big campaign contributions and worked on his campaign, seems like the smart thing to do would be to mingle and party with them at the end, he's counting on their support when it comes time for re-election.
    Sure, lots of individual celebrities made significant contributions to Obama's campaign. As "celebrities from Hollywood" is not some cohesive body of people, however, it would have been impossible for Obama to attend to all of them in some sort of deliberate, systematic fashion that's being suggested here. Instead, we see him going to ten official balls where some celebrities are present (including at a military ball), and we conclude from this that he's pandering to celebrities. I'm just saying that this is an erroneous conclusion to draw from the fact that he didn't attend the StH ball, and the fact that celebrities were present at the other balls.
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  6. #96
    Senior Member dga's Avatar
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    Bush attended the infamous ball in question during his tenure and subsequently the troops had issues with proper armor and protection in iraq.

    this controversy is stupid. There were 2 million extra people in dc that day. If bush could get away with saying nothing for 8 years out of security concerns, than obama should get some slack.

  7. #97
    Reason vs Being ragashree's Avatar
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  8. #98
    Nerd King Usurper Edgar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dga View Post
    Bush attended the infamous ball in question during his tenure and subsequently the troops had issues with proper armor and protection in iraq.

    this controversy is stupid. There were 2 million extra people in dc that day. If bush could get away with saying nothing for 8 years out of security concerns, than obama should get some slack.
    What kind of an argument is that?

    "The last president was even worse so lets give this guy slack for doing something crass"

    I don't want to have a shitty President, or a President who is slightly less shitty than the one before. I just want to have a goddamn respectable President.

  9. #99
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    ^ thank you. My sentiments exactly.
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  10. #100
    Senior Member dga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    What kind of an argument is that?

    "The last president was even worse so lets give this guy slack for doing something crass"

    I don't want to have a shitty President, or a President who is slightly less shitty than the one before. I just want to have a goddamn respectable President.
    no, my argument is that the symoblism is meaningless.

    i can dig why some are attatched t othe symbolism, btu the last 8 years should be a good lesson for anyone placing faith in symbolism.


    up to 2 million extra people in the city... lots of armchair generals weighing in on this. I dont want ot imagine what kind of chaos would have happened should obama been shot at that night.

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