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  1. #321
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Nope. You said so yourself. You want the military to be filled with Redneck Jims. You care more about the sensitivities of rough country boys than you do about having a fair military that is run by professionals who can get job done even when working with gays.
    Don't put words in my mouth, you're not very skilled at it.

    The Officer Corps is not made up of rednecks, nor should it be, nor did I say that I'd love if it were. But the best front line troops are very often country boys who aren't cool with gay guys in their squads. You can't change their minds anytime soon, hence the conflict.

  2. #322
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    Don't put words in my mouth, you're not very skilled at it.

    The Officer Corps is not made up of rednecks, nor should it be, nor did I say that I'd love if it were. But the best front line troops are very often country boys who aren't cool with gay guys in their squads. You can't change their minds anytime soon, hence the conflict.
    Putting words in your mouth? Let's recap...

    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Who do you want serving our country, the guy who is professional enough to work alongside gay people or Redneck Jim?
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    Redneck Jim.
    The reality here is you make your arguments based on aesthetics rather than reason. You have a particular sentiment for how the military should be as opposed to actual evidence of what works best.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
    OMNi: Wisdom at the cost of Sanity.

  3. #323
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    The reality here is you make your arguments based on aesthetics rather than reason.
    You didn't specify which part of the power structure you were talking about previously, and as such I discussed a general notion as any reasonable person would. More people are Privates and Sergeants than Captains and Generals.


    You have a particular sentiment for how the military should be as opposed to actual evidence of what works best.
    You're telling me you have evidence that a military which allows open homosexuality definitively works better than one which doesn't? You seem to be saying that, but I know you don't.

  4. #324
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    You're telling me you have evidence that a military which allows open homosexuality definitively works better than one which doesn't?
    Yeah, its called the Israeli army.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
    OMNi: Wisdom at the cost of Sanity.

  5. #325
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Yeah, its called the Israeli army.
    Not this again. I have it on good authority that the general culture from which the military is recruited in Israel is much more open to homosexuality than here in the USA.

    Furthermore, that is no such thing as evidence that their military works better than ours!

  6. #326
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    I think a thousand lesbian eyebrows just went up.
    LOL

  7. #327
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    Not this again. I have it on good authority that the general culture from which the military is recruited is much more open to homosexuality than here in the USA.

    Furthermore, that is no such thing as evidence that their military works better than ours!
    I hope it doesn't work better than ours. After all, we put more money into ours than the rest of the world puts into their militarys combined. However, if you want to compare Israel to countries that dedicate similar numbers of resources to their military but don't allow gays to serve, then have at it.

    Anyways, as I have said over and over, my main evidence has been the fact that our soldiers have been able to serve alongside openly gay soldiers. What actually works seems to be pretty compelling evidence for what works best.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
    OMNi: Wisdom at the cost of Sanity.

  8. #328
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Anyways, as I have said over and over, my main evidence has been the fact that our soldiers have been able to serve alongside openly gay soldiers. What actually works seems to be pretty compelling evidence for what works best.
    And yet they also seem to work quite well exclusively with straight soldiers and potentially secret homosexuals. I estimate better, even, but this is just my analysis (Analysis being what I do all day, quite well).

  9. #329
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    And yet they also seem to work quite well exclusively with straight soldiers and potentially secret homosexuals. I estimate better, even, but this is just my analysis (Analysis being what I do all day, quite well).
    You mean an analysis based on aesthetics, because you would actually need evidence to make an analysis based on reason.

    Personally, I would hate to be the last in NATO to allow gays to openly serve. I see many of the wars in the future being fought in coalitions. When Redneck Jim is more concerned that the gay British soldier might be checking out his butt than he is with accomplishing his mission, we may all be wishing we had had actual professionals getting the job done for us.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
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  10. #330
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    You mean an analysis based on aesthetics, because you would actually need evidence to make an analysis based on reason.
    Where do you get these ideas? It's observation and reason, son. Not idealistic notions haphazardly reinforced by linkspam.

    Personally, I would hate to be the last in NATO to allow gays to openly serve. I see many of the wars in the future being fought in coalitions. When Redneck Jim is more concerned that the gay British soldier might be checking out his butt than he is concerned with accomplishing his mission, we may all be wishing we had had actual professionals getting the job done for us.
    That's a good point. I think the UK should repeal all allowances for open homosexuality in its military.

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