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  1. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by 01011010 View Post
    My reasoning has nothing to do with pride or joy. I've already stated any homosexual that flaunts their sexuality in the military, isn't cut out for that kind of work. It's inappropriate.
    Logical processing error.

    Your pride and joy while preaching your cause, not the pride and joy of gays within the military.

  2. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    You think it's high benefit because your pride and joy is the advancement of homosexual "acceptance" in all arenas, despite cost.
    It's clear that ideology, not actual military considerations, are the real motive here.

  3. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    It's clear that ideology, not actual military considerations, are the real motive here.
    It is. I've tried to point that out, but it has of course fallen upon deaf ears, as the idealist's ears always are to pragmatic considerations.

  4. #194
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    I would say it's at its most vulnerable point in a decade, if not longer.
    First of all, for the USA, the most vulnerable point in a decade still might be stronger than almost everyone else. We spend an unusually high percentage of our GDP on the military for a first world nation, if I recall.

    A lot of the weakness of the military as it presently exists is the result of exhaustion, which is itself the result of very bad command. If the military were being handled with even mediocre performance I think it would be in a fairly food state.

    As for recruitment; how much do you want to bet that the financial crisis sends the numbers up?
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  5. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Well, some would argue that the US army is powerful beyond need right now anyway. It can handle a little trouble.
    That's the obvious benefit. Honestly, the military needs dedicated soldiers that willingly give their life to the cause. A soldier that made that decision of their own free will, is going to be much better at their job, then someone that isn't really interested in being there. Not only that, but gays are like everyone else. They have pride for their country. They want to protect their family and friends as well. I'm incredibly thankful to anyone that chooses the occupation.

  6. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    First of all, for the USA, the most vulnerable point in a decade still might be stronger than almost everyone else. We spend an unusually high percentage of our GDP on the military for a first world nation, if I recall.

    A lot of the weakness of the military as it presently exists is the result of exhaustion, which is itself the result of very bad command. If the military were being handled with even mediocre performance I think it would be in a fairly food state.

    As for recruitment; how much do you want to bet that the financial crisis sends the numbers up?
    If your goals are inconsiderate of maximizing the efficiency of the US Military, then advisor to the US Military is probably low in the list of best hobbies for you.

  7. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by 01011010 View Post
    That's the obvious benefit. Honestly, the military needs dedicated soldiers that willingly give their life to the cause. A soldier that made that decision of their own free will, is going to be much better at their job, then someone that isn't really interested in being there. Not only that, but gays are like everyone else. They have pride for their country. They want to protect their family and friends as well. I'm incredibly thankful to anyone that chooses the occupation.
    So your logical cost-benefit analysis has resulted in the conclusion:

    "It's beneficial because they can handle a little trouble."

    F'n well done, mate.

  8. #198
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    If your goals are inconsiderate of maximizing the efficiency of the US Military, then advisor to the US Military is probably low in the list of best hobbies for you.
    And?

    A lot of people that call the shots in this country shouldn't have that as their motive. Sometimes, it is actually a very good, I would dare say necessary thing, to have some civilian interference in the processing of the military. Single-minded, isolated miltiary command has a history of ugly results.

    There are absolutely times to cut back on the military. Will a military official be the one to support that? Of course not! But they can be over-ruled.
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  9. #199
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    So your logical cost-benefit analysis has resulted in the conclusion:

    "It's beneficial because they can handle a little trouble."

    F'n well done, mate.
    I would say there is distinctly an ethical element to her argument, but that does not necessarily make it wrong. To paint her stance more fairly, she thinks that the rights of gays should be represented by the military, and it can be done, because they can handle the trouble.

    You felt the need to only mention the cost without the benefit.

    EDIT: Oh, and for the record Jack, those who are the most logical arguers are those that attempt to find the most intelligent interpretations of what their opponent is saying.
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  10. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Sometimes, it is actually a very good, I would dare say necessary thing, to have some civilian interference in the processing of the military. Single-minded, isolated miltiary command has a history of ugly results.
    Of course the military is subordinate to civilian control and that's how it should be. After all, war is politics by other means. However, the civilian control still needs effective understanding of military affairs in order to do its job, and needlessly interfering with the military for political purposes has had a terrible effect as well.

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