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  1. #221
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cimarron View Post
    Come on, the free education thing is nothing new. Most of us have heard about it. You probably even know an American's typical response.
    Actually I don't (to some degree)

    I have only heard that US loses about half of its potential students because they can't afford high education to themselfs.

  2. #222
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    Oh, I thought you would know. It's a pretty common political discussion topic.

    The response is something like "The cost ($ price) is not avoided, it is just taken from somewhere else." There are several people on this part of the forum who can probably give you the proper reasoning. I'm not an expert on it...
    You can't spell "justice" without ISTJ.

  3. #223
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cimarron View Post
    Oh, I thought you would know. It's a pretty common political discussion topic.

    The response is something like "The cost ($ price) is not avoided, it is just taken from somewhere else." There are several people on this part of the forum who can probably give you the proper reasoning. I'm not an expert on it...
    In that case I know the deal.

  4. #224
    Member hjomn's Avatar
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    Yup, I find it quite remarkable, also. As for me, I'm Dutch and I'm always amazed that such an important element of future Americans does not get financed. 1500 euros a year for a native, and you can get your university degree here in Holland. Talk about blessings

  5. #225
    Senior Member dga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Surely it's a question of values.

    You hate losers and love guns, while we love losers and ban guns.

    We gained our independence without killing anyone, while you waged an eight year war of treachery against the Crown.

    And we united a whole continent without killing anyone, while you waged one of the worst civil wars on record.

    You are revolutionaries who waged a patricidal war, and like all revolutionaries you ate your children in the civil war.

    But the first casualty of revolution is irony.

    You want to cast us in your own image and you are deaf to irony.

    That's why we have to shout at you.
    that, and i guess since so many aussies are such <creeps>. It must be easy to unite a country when tehre is fuck all between the coasts besides desert and certainly difficult to compare to americas independance when the island was not even started to be colonized until after america declared its independence. Seriously, you dont think the industrial revolution might have have changed the game? Australias entire population is about that of the nyc metro area.

    did Australia win its independence or did the british empire sorta crumble and they just couldnt bother to care anymore? Just how long did it that process take?


    btw, how are the natives doing over there?

    I've met some really nice people from australia, however.
    Last edited by Bellflower; 02-07-2009 at 01:41 PM. Reason: Watch the language, please... public forum

  6. #226
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    I am curious, how would people from the US look at this.

    Here in Croatia you can get a bachelor degree on a state universities for about
    1000-1500$ dollars and master degree is totally free. But the level of education is not that low. You just have to have a place to sleep and something to eat.
    In the US, we already have a bunch of lazy kids going to college "for the experience" that never graduate. I'm sure making it so more can do the same would be a great idea. Btw, if you're talking about the equivalent of a community college or a tech school, we already have those.

    Where did you get your "loses 50% of potential students" statistic? I'm thinking someone just pulled that out of their ass. Virtually everyone can get student loans.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  7. #227
    Senior Member dga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    (I'm commenting on the bolded part mostly.) Overall taxes in Europe are not much different from taxes in the US. The difference is that the US spends a lot of its tax dollars on the military and uses it to guard and police the world (including Europe). The US does spend a signficant amount of tax dollars on benefiting people, but it is non-Americans getting the most of the benefit of our military. Europeans as a result need to spend less money on their military which means they can afford to give their citizens even greater benefits.

    In other words Europeans are getting two types of benefits Americans are not getting. 1) Free military protection. 2) Extra social services which can be afforded because of savings on military spending.
    Wanna compare value added tax? IN nyc you pay 8-9%. In germany, 19%. NYC is considered to have a high sales tax for the US, whereas the 19 percent is standard for all of germany.

    I am actually curious, but does hte US military pay property taxes on its bases to account for the roads and other local utilites and services they use in other countries, because soldiers are not obligated to support the local economy.

    sorry, but I fail to see where the foreign military bases is for the protection of european nations. The cold war was a long time ago, and most of it was actually just posturing.

  8. #228
    Senior Member dga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    In the US, we already have a bunch of lazy kids going to college "for the experience" that never graduate. I'm sure making it so more can do the same would be a great idea. Btw, if you're talking about the equivalent of a community college or a tech school, we already have those.

    Where did you get your "loses 50% of potential students" statistic? I'm thinking someone just pulled that out of their ass. Virtually everyone can get student loans.
    Would you rather the next generation has the opportunity to learn how to advance themselves and their nation in the world or work medial service jobs like at walmart? The US does not have that great an apprenticeship system, so there really isnt much in between. You cant compare american 2 year schools to the german apprenticeship system, as the german system simply walks all over it.

    Lazy people exist in every society.

    The point about this thread is that europeans do not need the kinds of loans americans need for higher education.

  9. #229
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    In the US, we already have a bunch of lazy kids going to college "for the experience" that never graduate. I'm sure making it so more can do the same would be a great idea. Btw, if you're talking about the equivalent of a community college or a tech school, we already have those.

    Where did you get your "loses 50% of potential students" statistic? I'm thinking someone just pulled that out of their ass. Virtually everyone can get student loans.

    I have simply heard for that 50% few years ago somwhere I not saying that this information is necessarily correct. But it makes sense that some people don't want to go into debt over this.

  10. #230
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dga View Post
    Would you rather the next generation has the opportunity to learn how to advance themselves and their nation in the world or work medial service jobs like at walmart? The US does not have that great an apprenticeship system, so there really isnt much in between. You cant compare american 2 year schools to the german apprenticeship system, as the german system simply walks all over it.
    You talk as though no one can get a college education in the US. That's not the case. Regardless, Wal-mart needs employees, too. I'd rather my tax dollars not go to pay for some punk to go party for a few years, then drop out.

    I don't know anything about the german apprenticeship system, so I can't comment on it. If you're up for explaining it, rather than trash talking, I'm willing to listen.

    Lazy people exist in every society.
    From what I hear from Europeans, Americans are the laziest (along with the fattest and stupidest).

    The point about this thread is that europeans do not need the kinds of loans americans need for higher education.
    Really?

    I don't know much about European universities, but I have the feeling that the entire structure is different than the US.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

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