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  1. #21
    Per Ardua Metamorphosis's Avatar
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    I would probably vote for a number of the Republican candidates before I voted for Hillary Clinton, though. I don't like:

    socialists
    people who treat their staff like shit
    someone who can't even fake not being ruthless
    "You will always be fond of me. I represent to you all the sins you never had the courage to commit."

    Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions, and can never pretend to any other office
    than to serve and obey them. - David Hume

  2. #22
    Senior Member htb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metamorphosis View Post
    I don't like: socialists
    Of the Democratic contenders, Bill Richardson is the one least disapproving of and hostile to the free market. His literature apparently makes broad reference to "tax credits," a term otherwise reserved on the left for politically specific application. That leaves him, of course, quite a ways from John McCain, the Republican candidate who would most favor the state over the private sector.

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by htb View Post
    Of the Democratic contenders, Bill Richardson is the one least disapproving of and hostile to the free market. His literature apparently makes broad reference to "tax credits," a term otherwise reserved on the left for politically specific application. That leaves him, of course, quite a ways from John McCain, the Republican candidate who would most favor the state over the private sector.
    Bill Richardson is my favorite, but he doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell. I also really loved McCain the last time around, but since 2004 he's been assimilated by the GOP Borg and isn't his own man like he used to be.

  4. #24
    Senior Member htb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FMWarner View Post
    but since 2004 he's been assimilated by the GOP Borg and isn't his own man like he used to be.
    Yes, and we, Htb, are one of them. But it is only to better ourselves and others.

  5. #25
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    The Republican roster stinks right now. Is Guliani the best they can do? It's rather pathetic.
    Many rank-and-file Republicans are poised to stay home or go third-party if Giuliani turns out to be the nominee. It's because they aren't willing to negotiate on abortion.

  6. #26

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    Vote Ron Paul.

    Meanwhile, Obama?...

    Weak. And a democrat. Two very bad things.
    God may be defined as the being than which none greater can be concieved.
    I have in my mind the possibility of God.
    -The God exists in the mind and not in reality.
    -But if such a being that exists in the mind and reality is greater than in the mind and not reality.
    -That is a contradiction!
    Therefore, it is not the case that the being exists in the mind and not reality.
    Restated, if the being exists in the mind, then it exists in reality.
    ----------
    God exists in reality.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metamorphosis View Post
    I would probably vote for a number of the Republican candidates before I voted for Hillary Clinton, though. I don't like:

    socialists
    people who treat their staff like shit
    someone who can't even fake not being ruthless
    It's interesting you make the inference that Republicans do not possess these traits.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cindyrella View Post
    Totally open-ended thread here. I'm very interested in learning more about him as a potential candidate for the presidency. What do you think of him? Barack vs. Hillary? Do you believe he has a good shot? If you aren't really impressed by him, why? And who do you think would be a better Democratic candidate?
    He strikes me as being a very good speaker, very articulate, very compassionate and seems to be a kind of idealistic type with a good, sensible backing although not as experienced as the other candidates.

  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    The Republican roster stinks right now. Is Guliani the best they can do? It's rather pathetic.
    :ouch:

    Ron Paul.
    God may be defined as the being than which none greater can be concieved.
    I have in my mind the possibility of God.
    -The God exists in the mind and not in reality.
    -But if such a being that exists in the mind and reality is greater than in the mind and not reality.
    -That is a contradiction!
    Therefore, it is not the case that the being exists in the mind and not reality.
    Restated, if the being exists in the mind, then it exists in reality.
    ----------
    God exists in reality.

  9. #29
    Member warick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Many rank-and-file Republicans are poised to stay home or go third-party if Giuliani turns out to be the nominee. It's because they aren't willing to negotiate on abortion.
    This is very true, but misguided. Republicans have a good chance to take back Congress this next election because the democrats are screwing everything up like usual. Giuliani doesn't have much to say about abortion if Congress legislates adversely.

    Obama is a charming person, but so was Clinton and he turned out to be one of our worst presidents in recent history. Obama's campaign site makes him out to be pretty middle of the road, but his voting record, as posted by Heart says a lot more. He hasn't been a Senator that long, but pretty much all his votes have been for increasing Federal spending, increasing taxes, and just bad in general for the economy (i.e. increasing minimum wage substantially, soft on Illegal Immigrants).

    Unfortunately, the best Republican candidates are the least heard of ones, that doesn't mean they don't have a chance. There is lot of support here in the Portland area for Ron Paul, but a lot of Republicans don't like him because he's too Libertarian (aka: anti-war). My vote is going for Duncan Hunter, his campaign statements and his voting record line up perfectly, and he is exactly the man America needs as their next President.
    I'm not being critical, I'm just trying to make you a better person.

  10. #30

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    A few points to ponder and notes of contention:

    - Voting records are only as accurate as your reading of the bill/amendment. Unfortunately, many laws and bills include all sorts of add-ons which have nothing to do with the bulk. We'd all do well to push for a single-issue law regarding Congressional legislation.

    - Socialism is misunderstood by the majority of Americans due to Republican red-scare tactics. Socialism is not communism, but communism is a version of socialism. Capitalism is not fascism, but fascism (which is more of what Nazi Germany was though they misleadingly used the term socialists)...fascism is a form of capitalism.

    -For the most part, Democrats and Republicans have the same voting record concerning economic legislation. Bush could not spend half a trillion on Iraq if Democrats filibustered, yet Democrats still pretend to be different than Republicans and vice versa. The only real differences between Republicans and Democrats is not in economics or the size of government/government intervention but rather social/moral issues.

    Personally speaking:
    I would vote for a Green or Socialist Party candidate before Demonstrative Republicans and Representative Democrats (which as I said before are more like a single party with two camps). There is serious imbalance in American politics since the advent of WWII and then the Cold War.
    Expectation: Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama will clinch the democratic ticket as P and VP. Republicans will push hard on moral issues while falling short due to multiple ethics, divorce, and public bathroom situations. Blind patriots and do-gooder wannabes will vote Republican based on single issues without seeing the broader hypocrisy of the party at large.



    *Edit: From what I've seen of him, I am assured by his composure and lack of government experience. People who have been in the government for a long time end up one of two ways: totally immersed in it and loving/living the corruption...or...on their way out and considering the realities of a comfortable existence somewhere outside of America. Barack seems, emphasis on seems, to be different, but his voting record like every other candidate out there comes out wanting. Believe it or not, I think most Americans are centrists economically and state vs. individual. Unfortunately all our Dems and Reps seem to be more into state authority and capitalism. Barack Obama definitely moves toward the centrist area better than the rest.
    Last edited by Eternue-MDL; 11-04-2007 at 09:04 AM. Reason: bringing back to topic

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