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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    Thats the way it is dude. Be thankful that you live in a nation where you do have the freedom to fight for what you believe in, and to fight for what YOU think is right and just. Just know that others will have their own views and will also put up a fight. The fact the we have the right to do this is a blessed thing. You may fight and fight and fight for YEARS to eventually get what you want. Even if you do win over a majority to your side in favor of gay marriage, the battle still wont be over. A battle such as this will never end until (God I say this a lot) the beliefs, morals, and social order of the country as a whole has completely changed. Until that day (if the day comes), if gay marriage is what you want, I predict you will be fighting over it for quite some time because there will always be the opposing side that has the right to craft their own laws and rights as they see fit, just as you are rightfully trying to do.

    With that said, the issue is really starting to grow really old on me, really fast.
    Oh Risen, I'm so proud. You do know it's your choice to stay and continue the conversation on the topic.

    [Enter Segue Here], my friends are going in hordes. It's going to be a big deal.

  2. #32
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    Wasn't 50% the threshold required to pass this law? That's why it was such a mad race at the end, right? So how about they raise the threshold, maybe to 2/3 majority instead of (1/2)+ majority?
    You can't spell "justice" without ISTJ.

  3. #33
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    Yes, it is. That is why we have 50 separate states. The choice of where you want to live and under what laws is given to you by the existence of 50 individual states. No, I don't think a ban on interracial marriage was good, but it wasn't a federal law or a law in every state either.
    Heh, it's a good thing there are so many countries out there too, eh? That way when Obama passes his socialist policies, you'll be able to move!

    Equal rights for all people, equal representation, etc. is enshrined in the US. But apparently it is somewhat conditional.

  4. #34
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    Heh, it's a good thing there are so many countries out there too, eh? That way when Obama passes his socialist policies, you'll be able to move!

    Equal rights for all people, equal representation, etc. is enshrined in the US. But apparently it is somewhat conditional.
    There's a pretty big difference. It's relatively easy to move between states. You don't have to apply for citizenship. Moving to another country is a much bigger ordeal.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  5. #35
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    There's a pretty big difference. It's relatively easy to move between states. You don't have to apply for citizenship. Moving to another country is a much bigger ordeal.
    Oh. Then you just don't care enough to make the move, I guess. Or don't have the skills required to be in demand elsewhere. Rather like not having the money to quit your job and move to another state.

    (Yes, this is somewhat tongue in cheek.)

  6. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    So everyone who voted for prop 8 is uneducated and ignorant?
    Quote Originally Posted by Didums View Post
    Ignorant of what they were voting for, and uneducated in the nature of homosexuality and the role of government in society. Satisfied?
    Uh, no. I voted against it and even I see what a caricature that portrayal is. I'm certain that hearing things like that pushed some fence sitters to a "yes" vote out of spite.
    Everybody have fun tonight. Everybody Wang Chung tonight.

    Johari
    /Nohari

  7. #37
    homo-loving sonovagun anii's Avatar
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    Does all this lively discussion mean you guys will make an appearance at your local rally this Saturday? Hope so.

    Going back to taking positive action...

    I got all excited participating in the election campaign, even though it was scary at times.

    But now that I've checked that goal of my to do list - and yes, it felt exceedingly satisfying to do so, I need another hobby as it were.

    I try to follow where my passion leads me. One of the ways I know I'm passionate about something is if it gets my ire up. And this certainly does. It seems like a no-brainer to me, so I am going to stand with people I care about and strangers alike to register my disagreement with what the states of California, Arizona, and Florida have done.

    I came up with my sign ideas today:

    On side one: If the government outlawed marriage between Christians, what would you do?
    On side two: The Bible says: "There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out all fear." Choose Love. (It feels better anyway.)

    Side two is wordy I know, but I will apply my graphic skills to make it work.

    I wanted to keep my messages on the positive side.

    What are your sign ideas?
    There's reason to be afraid, and reason to open your heart. ~ Seal

    Refreshment for your ears: www.kexp.org

  8. #38
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    I hope that none of you will participate in these sorts of lewd acts, or condone it in any way. This story really sickened me.

    FOXNews.com - Cross-Bearing Woman Says She Was Attacked by Gay Marriage Supporters, May Press Charges - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News

    video- YouTube - GAY MARRIAGE PROPONENTS ATTACK ELDERLY WOMAN

    An elderly woman who attended a gay rights protest carrying a cross to voice her support of the new California ban on gay marriage says she was attacked by demonstrators and now may press charges.

    Palm Springs Police Department spokesman Sgt. Mitch Spike told FOXNews.com no arrests had been made as of Thursday evening and added that victim Phyllis Burgess still is deciding whether she'll press assault charges.

    "The investigation is proceeding as it should," Spike said.

    Asked if the charges could be elevated to include hate crime penalties, Spike told FOXNews.com, "That's a possibility. That's one of the things we're looking at."

    Carrying a large, foam cross, Burgess, 69, showed up at a rally last Friday against Proposition 8, the ban on same-sex marriage approved this month by California voters.

    She was there to show her belief in traditional marriage, she said.

    Within minutes, however, angry protesters swarmed around the Palm Springs resident, yanked the cross from her hands and trampled on it, as seen in a video of the incident posted on YouTube.

    "I guess I didnt see the gravity of the whole thing and how it was being portrayed to the public," Burgess told The Desert Sun newspaper. "People are incensed. They seem to want some kind of justice."
    Related

    *
    Video
    o Freedom of Speech?

    If charges are filed, Spike said prosecution could be difficult because the alleged suspect or suspects seen in the video have yet to be identified.

    "We haven't been able to identify everyone in that video," Spike told FOXNews.com.

  9. #39
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    This story sickens me: Fight over Prop. 8 results in assaults - 11/04/08 - San Francisco News - abc7news.com

    San Mateo police said five to seven individuals opposed to Proposition 8, which would take away the right for same-sex couples to marry, were displaying signs at the intersection of Third Avenue and Humboldt Street. Ten to 15 supporters of the proposition were displaying signs of their own.

    Around 4 p.m., an argument began between a man in his 20s and a 17-year-old girl when police said the man knocked down the girl and struck her in the head.

    Police said a man, later identified as 35-year-old Ivan Schaumkel, ran up and spit in the girl's face. A resident nearby attempted to help break up the altercation but was punched in the face by a male juvenile, police said.
    The juvenile and Schaumkel were both arrested for assault by responding officers and released but the initial suspect is still outstanding. He is described as a Polynesian man, 6 feet 2 inches, 250 pounds, and was wearing a white T-shirt.
    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    I hope that none of you will participate in these sorts of lewd acts, or condone it in any way. This story really sickened me.
    Maybe the bigots should stay away from the people who's rights they voted to take away? Just a thought...

    Shit happens, look at history, those kinds of things happen all the time, in the past it was much much worse.
    Quote Originally Posted by EffEmDoubleyou View Post
    I'm certain that hearing things like that pushed some fence sitters to a "yes" vote out of spite.
    If people voted Yes out of spite, they are children who lack the maturity to deserve the right to vote.




    Side note: The Freedom of speech argument is retarded in this case fellas, because the people claiming they have to right to it are the ones infringing on the rights of others.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didums View Post
    This story sickens me: Fight over Prop. 8 results in assaults - 11/04/08 - San Francisco News - abc7news.com



    Maybe the bigots should stay away from the people who's rights they voted to take away? Just a thought...

    Shit happens, look at history, those kinds of things happen all the time, in the past it was much much worse.
    I hope you're not insinuating that one side or the other started that altercation, because it is NOT said which group started it. Either way, you are correct, it is disgusting; no matter who started it.

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