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Thread: Prop 8

  1. #121
    mountain surfing nomadic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    It's not possible to separate social issues from the education system.
    people do it all the time. how do u think kids learn another language at home? another culture at home? another religion at home?

  2. #122
    Guerilla Urbanist Brendan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    Think about every one of your teachers for a moment. <think>

    Done? Now, roughly what percentage of them would you want telling you about life (when you're brain is not physiologically mature enough and you aren't old enough to have life experience to think rationally about what all of these teachers say)?

    What do you think the correlation is between teachers who want to convince all the kids to see things exactly the way they do, and the teachers that are likely to speak up? Probably very high.

    If you don't want a Christian teacher teaching your kid about how there's a heaven and you can only get into it if you accept Jesus Christ as your personal saviour, you can apply the same reasoning to why lots of people don't want teachers teaching their kids about complex adult relationships.

    Parenting is for parents; teachers teach.
    Then don't have any sexual education at all, we've seen how well that works out.

    And this is all full of projection. Children are children. They don't know wtf gay or straight means, or if they do, they certainly don't fully grasp it.

    Saying "some men marry other men, and some women marry other women" will not spark a class-wide musing between 10 year olds over the existential burdens of a committed relationship with another human being anymore than saying "most men marry women and vis versa" will.
    There is no such thing as separation from God.

  3. #123
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Modern Nomad View Post
    Why would I want to define it? I'm not gay.

    I mean, i really hope u guys can marry. But why teach it to kids. Young, moldable kids. They should be learning science, sharing, math, friendship, all that good stuff.

    i don't mind a teacher telling kids that "gays are people with just different choices in life..." but im sure there will be teachers who subtley tell kids "this is what you should be when you grow up, bc i tell u to"

    just why deal with that?
    Because kids should be aware they have a choice in the matter rather than be socially conditioned to be averse to what should be a relatively straight forward right. The interpretation of what I said is that you fear that your child will become something because of teaching, yet what is being said is that by letting them know of the option, they have the freedom to choose. In effect, you wish to remove the choice from your children, but don't see it that way. IMO, it is a rationalisation of fear.

  4. #124
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainChick View Post
    Blacks are inferior to whites, women are inferior to men, gays are inferior to heterosexuals and do not deserve the same rights.

    IF YOU DON'T SEE THE SIMILARITIES IN THESE IN ANALOGIES, SORRY.
    Most people you're arguing with agree with you--gays should have full rights. I fully believe that. Just like religious people should have full rights. The details just shouldn't be taught in the classroom by teachers. Which apparently isn't part of Prop 8, though people brought it up and I assumed it was.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  5. #125
    mountain surfing nomadic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didums View Post
    You lose.

    GTFO

    You no longer have the right to speak about this topic anymore because of that post.
    i actually rather talk to a gay person directly about this. they seem more sensible.

  6. #126
    Guerilla Urbanist Brendan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Modern Nomad View Post
    Why would I want to define it? I'm not gay.
    Because it's the crux of your argument, [happy little tree]!
    Last edited by Ivy; 11-05-2008 at 08:45 PM. Reason: removed insult
    There is no such thing as separation from God.

  7. #127
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brendan View Post
    Then don't have any sexual education at all, we've seen how well that works out.

    And this is all full of projection. Children are children. They don't know wtf gay or straight means, or if they do, they certainly don't fully grasp it.

    Saying "some men marry other men, and some women marry other women" will not spark a class-wide musing between 10 year olds over the existential burdens of a committed relationship with another human being anymore than saying "most men marry women and vis versa" will.
    Absolutely, QFT!!!
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  8. #128
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brendan View Post
    Then don't have any sexual education at all, we've seen how well that works out.

    And this is all full of projection. Children are children. They don't know wtf gay or straight means, or if they do, they certainly don't fully grasp it.

    Saying "some men marry other men, and some women marry other women" will not spark a class-wide musing between 10 year olds over the existential burdens of a committed relationship with another human being anymore than saying "most men marry women and vis versa" will.
    If all the teacher is going to say is "some men marry other men, and some women marry other women" why would anyone have a problem with that?

    The problem arises when a teacher expands with their subjective opinion. How many of your teachers would've been able to communicate pure objectivity on issues of religion or sexual orientation? Not all. Likely not most. Thus, these issues should stay out of the classroom.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brendan View Post
    Then don't have any sexual education at all, we've seen how well that works out.

    And this is all full of projection. Children are children. They don't know wtf gay or straight means, or if they do, they certainly don't fully grasp it.

    Saying "some men marry other men, and some women marry other women" will not spark a class-wide musing between 10 year olds over the existential burdens of a committed relationship with another human being anymore than saying "most men marry women and vis versa" will.
    i don't think we should teach kids anything about marriage at all. they can obviously know from when they go home to see their parent(s)

    they are kids!

    i mean, sheesh. let them be kids. they don't even know what adults argue about.

  10. #130

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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    Then why are people talking about it in this thread? I prefaced my first post with a statement that everything I'd learned about Prop 8 was from this thread.
    People are talking about it because of inflammatory TV ads by the pro-8 lobby that asked "Do you want your kids being taught gay marriage in school?" and showed a little boy coming home from school saying "I want to be a princess!" Such tactics provoked the LA Superindendent of Schools to make his own commercial assuring the citizenry that marriage is not taught in school, gay or otherwise. Obviously it didn't work, and the scare tactics did.
    Everybody have fun tonight. Everybody Wang Chung tonight.

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