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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    Attachment 2701

    The market should know what's good for it, right? Obama gets elected, and when stocks open on Nov. 4th, the market immediately dropped 154 points and closed nearly 500 points below the value it ended at on the previous day.
    I saw that the exit polls at some point showed 23% were afraid of an Obama presidency. I wonder which 23% that was? (hint hint)

  2. #32
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    The market should know what's good for it, right? Obama gets elected, and when stocks open on Nov. 4th, the market immediately dropped 154 points and closed nearly 500 points below the value it ended at on the previous day.
    Depends what is priced in, the speculation, other factors, etc.

    IRC the market tends to rise after a democratic nomination, over the month or so afterwards. We'll see if this is the case this time.

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    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Oy. My head hurts reading all of this. Socialism is not American in nature, imo. We wanted something different, and built our country based on that. It's my feeling that if you want socialism go to where it is, instead of making others change for you. If I wanted socialist things, I'd move and be content. We want to improve our government, not change it entirely, imo.

    Anyways, the middle class question is a very good one. I'd like to consider myself middle class.. but our family business's Adjusted Gross Income is borderline 250k. A lot of money passes through, but the cost of the business itself makes the business earn considerably less. The profit margin is small enough to where we all have other jobs and work on the business in spare time. We live comfortably, but not entirely debt-free (working toward it). Would we be considered middle class? and If so.. then should the tax count toward my business iyo? ..
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  4. #34
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    Depends what is priced in, the speculation, other factors, etc.

    IRC the market tends to rise after a democratic nomination, over the month or so afterwards. We'll see if this is the case this time.
    When you look at statistics over the long term, doesn't it become difficult to isolate which factors belong to what causes?

  5. #35
    Senior Member ZiL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    In terms of income (the reference to McCain would be)? Probably use quartiles. That's normally close to what is done.

    (I think that'd be about 35k-95k in the states IRC)

    Hmm, if that's the case, I am low class...


    Anyway, can anyone tell me what about Obama's proposed tax alterations is unprecedented? What is it that's making everyone cry "socialism" all the sudden?
    ALL AROUND THE WORLD PEOPLE EATIN' GUMBO

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    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    When you look at statistics over the long term, doesn't it become difficult to isolate which factors belong to what causes?
    Depends if it is correlation or causation. If the factor being measured is a root cause, it would be easy to isolate. If the correlation shifts because causes are changing underneath, it would be very difficult.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiL View Post
    Hmm, if that's the case, I am low class...


    Anyway, can anyone tell me what about Obama's proposed tax alterations is unprecedented? What is it that's making everyone cry "socialism" all the sudden?
    Look at the videos in the opening post.

  8. #38
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    Depends if it is correlation or causation. If the factor being measured is a root cause, it would be easy to isolate. If the correlation shifts because causes are changing underneath, it would be very difficult.
    How would you tell the difference between the two?

  9. #39
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    How would you tell the difference between the two?
    You can't, really. Not without being able to set up controls.

    Generally speaking though, since the economy tends to be better on almost all measurements under democrats, the causation chain is likely not to the party itself but the resulting policies from the party's mindset/platform.

  10. #40
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZiL View Post
    Hmm, if that's the case, I am low class...


    Anyway, can anyone tell me what about Obama's proposed tax alterations is unprecedented? What is it that's making everyone cry "socialism" all the sudden?
    The fact that he's aiming for other, wealthier people's money to be distributed on a larger scale to poorer people, the fact that said money will be easier to obtain thereby decreasing the potential ambition to pull anyone out of their current living states into something greater themselves, and the fact that the 250k bracket is adjusted gross income.. not profit margin based.. Need I speak more? Socialism is a fine government system for those countries who want it... but America isn't socialist. There are simply a lot of people who don't want to work for their money that like the idea of making rich people share with them.
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
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